<p>Until you get the alcohol, or any other substances she may be addicted to, out of the picture, you really can’t even know what the mental health issues are. And many drugs to help with organic mental health issues should not be taken with alcohol- very, very dangerous.<br>
ADHD is not really a mental illness, and depression possibly may be, depending. From the little bit you have shared here, it sounds like your daughter has been using alcohol to deal with her feelings, perhaps her ADHD, and to avoid dealing with life. It seems like this is the more serious issue right now. Until she is sober, you will not have any clarity regarding her mental health.</p>
<p>As with our older relatives, a big concern is not just a possible arrest, but the risk of a serious accident, maybe someone killed. </p>
<p>We now allow her to live at school during full terms so she will be back in the fall. It doesn’t help though, it just delays. She gets to be living on our dime doing whatever she wants. It is an urban campus so she doesn’t need a car there but she uses hers to go back and forth from school to home (which is where the parking and driving tickets pile up). Had to pay off $600 in her parking tickets because the car was in husband’s name (we traded in her new car and replaced it with something for hubby then gave her his old car) and found his credit score had tanked big time because all went to collections. Now that the car is in her name, it will be her credit rating that she messes up and her car that gets booted and we wont be forced to pay. And, we garnished her $600 income tax refund to cover that $600 so that will be covered.</p>
<p>I guess we just suck up three more semesters. Its better for our sanity to have her at school rather than home. For the summer I’m stuck w her here and with the tension and conflict and abuse she heaps on me.</p>
<p>ML-you know me. We have shared a bit of the mental health angle in the past and way back when, we knew each other IRL.</p>
<p>
</p>
<p>Of course; and any psychiatrist to whom she speaks should be aware of the alcohol use. Of course, now that the D is an adult, there’s no way to be sure she sees the doctor, tells him the truth, or follows his advice.</p>
<p>@Nrdsb4-bingo. She lies to the therapists or perhaps manipulates is a better word. I have historically sent messages about concerns to the current regular therapist then she started reading them to my D in session and D would refute everything of course. D wants us in therapy with her half the time. She is such a drain. We have spent so many hours talking and talking and it just spins.</p>
<p>I haven’t read the previous posts. I recommend family therapy with all of you ASAP. This is a family problem. In family therapy you can establish “norms” that are age appropriate and comfortable for all of you.</p>
<p>She may need individual counseling and much more, but the family therapist can make sure that everything is communicated properly from a family perspective and not make the family out to be the “bad guys.”</p>
<p>An alcoholic who is a chronic liar and who steals money is not a " young adult".
They are a disaster on wheels and they need targeted treatment plan.
BTW, why the HELL would you pay for her to regain her drivers liscense?
No wonder she is a mess.
She keeps pushing at the boundaries but they keep moving away on her.
Must be terribly frightening.</p>
<p>I feel for you and your husband and your marriage. It is incredibly hard to parent a tough child even when you are on the same page. Perhaps counseling at least for you two would be a start. A united front, even a “mediated” one, might be a good start. </p>
<p>I can’t tell you how to fix this. All I know, from my own experience with addicts and with a parent with mental health issues, is that often we are reactionary putting out fire after fire. That it is incredibly draining and all you want often is to be insulated from it. To have a week or month when it isn’t effecting you directly. I get it. I also believe that until the person wants to or must change they will not. With nice parents she may never get to that spot. On the other hand, you don’t want to risk her life or the lives of others (by her driving for example).</p>
<p>Very very touch. Best to you. </p>
<p>I actually agree with your plan now that it has unfolded more. She has three more semesters and the summer at home. You need to find a way to survive. I would still tell her she cannot move home after she graduates. I feel for you. The only relief we had from my daughter was when she decided not to return home. It was heartbreaking (she was still in high school), but once we got over the heartache we realized what a RELIEF it was. Now she works (I think) and rents (I’m pretty sure). She drives a car that someone gave her. She has her own health insurance (or so I’m told), and she’s responsible for herself. And when a collection company called we could honestly say we don’t know how to reach her and they didn’t call us again. Since I don’t hear much from her I don’t really know how she is doing, but I know I’m doing better, my husband is doing better, and her sister is doing better. Our family will never, ever be the same again, but life goes on. Things change.</p>
<p>I think you can be a nice parent and still be firm about boundaries, but I agree with TempeMom that the person needs to want to change in order do so. If the parents keep cleaning up the messes that result from poor choices, the young adult won’t see a reason to change.</p>
<p>I’m so sorry. That’s all I have. </p>
<p>A family therapist will work with all of you and will not allow splitting and blaming and other such behaviors. The purpose of the therapy will focus not on fixing her, but rather working on the family and allowing you to share what is on your minds in a safe environment. Unfortunately I don’t trust vulnerable and sick people to select their own therapists. I feel really sorry for you because in the current medical environment you need to quarterback all of the care and are not trained. Find a family therapist and work on “norms” for all of you. It should help. Really.</p>
<p>Totally agree with those who say she has to want to change and it doesn’t appear as though that’s the case. Of course, I also completely agree with those who say you haven’t given her much need to change. But, you know that. So, is she vulnerable and sick or she a lying, stealing, scheming, selfish drunk? These are not the same thing and you probably have a pretty good idea which it is by now. Also, the whole therapy thing. Ugh. It sounds as though she’s had plenty of therapy and has not made any positive progress. Sadly, I don’t know why you would expect a different result when you do more of the same old thing. Maybe, there is some family problem buried in there somewhere but from what I read she very much needs fixing. And, she really will have to do it herself. Right now, I doubt she even wants to change. There is no need and old habits die hard. This had already gone on way too long. imho.</p>
<p>Try NAMI’s local family-to-family group. Even consider attending the national NAMI conference. You will find lots of wise fellow travelers. When MI is in the mix, regular parenting tends not to work. Rather, you employ different techniques. </p>
<p>I will second the idea that, while you are naturally sympathetic if your D has a mental illness, “possibly bi-polar” is not a diagnosis. You are also spending a lot of money on therapy- and don’t know if it is effective or not. Lying to the therapist isn’t going to help her.</p>
<p>@nrdsb4 mentioned Borderline Personality Disorder, and I am wondering the same thing- of course this has to be confirmed by evaluation. In any case, even if a person is ill, unless they are very disconnected from reality- they know general right from wrong- and that stealing, driving drunk, lying, abusing alcohol are not something that is tolerated. </p>
<p>Every human behavior can be broken down into cost and payoff, and this can be applied to anyone- young, old, and with any mental condition, because we all work on a behavior/reward system. Some behaviors are simple to see. We work for the salary, spend time shopping for food because we like to eat. Humans are complicated, and sometimes they tolerate a very high price that doesn’t make sense looking from the outside, but there is a payoff for it or the person would not be doing it. So why are you tolerating your daughter’s abusive behavior towards you? She doesn’t value your money, your car, her education. Yes, she is sick and also an addict which explains her behavior, but only she can change that. Your husband may be tolerating this because he wants her to like him, or it is simply how he did it in his alcoholic family and is doing what he knows to do. </p>
<p>I don’t know why you tolerate it, but I can make some guesses, because I am a mom too, and we are so invested in our children. There is always fear of her being on her own. If she is under your roof, then you at least know she has a place to stay. But I suspect you also give into her, because it keeps the peace, and gives you some relief from her moods and temper. The payoff for her behavior is that knows it is working for her and gets her what she wants. Why would she change something that is working for her?</p>
<p>If you want anything to change, it has to come from you, because you can’t change her. Three more semesters in college isn’t going to change her as long as her behavior works for her. A counselor can help you see the patterns of behaviors in your family so that you can make changes. Change is hard - so please know I am not being critical of you. It is hard to change any behavior- losing weight, exercise, breaking habits-- all are hard, and so much more when it involved a child because we are all mama bears at heart. This is why support is helpful. </p>
<p>She is:
22
Lies
Manipulates
In and out of college, with three semesters left
Drinks daily, possibly an alcoholic
Probably bipolar
Steals your money
Disrupts your home
Disrupts your own emotional well-being
Has divided you and your husband</p>
<p>And those are the statements from her mom, the person who loves her more than anyone else ever will.</p>
<p>You are paying for her health insurance, her tuition, her auto insurance, her semester abroad, her therapy not covered by insurance, her DUI… You are living HER life, darting around behind her, cleaning up her messes and not allowing her to feel the natural consequences of her actions. You are not allowing her to be an adult.</p>
<p>Seriously, if you, the OP, were listening to someone else tell you these things, or if you were reading this as a story in a book, you would know exactly what “the mom” in that situation ought to do. It is very, very difficult to do the things that “ought” to be done, though.</p>
<p>Whether she is an alcoholic, or bipolar, or both, she for sure IS an adult who will seek appropriate help only when she is good and ready to do it. You can’t make her seek help and you can’t make her cooperate in the process.</p>
<p>You and your husband need to seek help together for yourselves to gain some insight and to find a way to be united on how you want to handle this adult who has been very, very successful so far in leading your family by the nose to get exactly what she wants. (I don’t know that she is consciously doing this, but does it matter?)</p>
<p>This will never change until you and your husband create a plan for yourselves and stick to it. Figure out what your boundaries are, and support each other in not allowing you daughter to cross them or to manipulate you.</p>
<p>I mean, she will manipulate you until she can’t… Until you no longer allow it.
As long as she can manipulate you why would she even try anything else? It has worked so well for her so far.</p>
<p>I have a dear friend who was diagnosed as bipolar twice before she finally was able to HEAR it, believe it, and stay with the meds. It changed her life, but it didn’t happen until her mid thirties. Her life before tha moment when it clicked was a mess, but SHE had to get to the place where she really wanted something else. Her parents couldn’t make her get there.</p>
<p>“She keeps pushing at the boundaries but they keep moving away on her.
Must be terribly frightening.”</p>
<p>THIS IS KEY!</p>
<p>
Well, that’s a discouraging twist for OP. Why would the insurance company have rules about things they don’t cover? (And why don’t they cover mental health; isn’t that supposed to be covered now?) The therapist is able to charge what she wants (not some negotiated rate with an insurance company) and doesn’t have to deal with insurance. So the more visits he/she can see the d for, the better (as I wrote before, a cash cow). </p>
<p>I don’t think much of this therapist, since she disregards the payer. How can she do this – ignoring a written directive from the one who pays? I hope the OP finds out if she CAN just stop paying the bills. Maybe a call in to the state licensing organization or psychologist association? Doesn’t sound like the therapist is helping much, anyway.</p>
<p>I’d also be concerned about the car insurance being under the parents’ names. Even if the car is titled to the d, if there is an accident, can’t the injured party come after the parents, too, since it’s their insurance even if not their car? </p>
<p>Wow, it’s hard to know where to start. You and your husband absolutely need to be on the same page. Sit down and have a long talk and agree what is going on and how your will both deal with it.</p>
<p>Why does she need a car at an urban school. Sell the car. Drop her off in the fall. She can take a trani, bus, get a ride home for thanksgiving and christmas. Or you could pick her up, but she does not need to be commuting home.</p>
<p>Biggest issues seem to drinking and mental health, Unfortunately you can’t fix this for her. YOu can only support her when she is actually ready and see the problem.</p>
<p>Change your credit cards and keep them locked up. Don’t use an excuse that she will only find them again.</p>
<p>How do you kick someone out of house? Pack the bag and put it on front porch. Change the locks. Call the cops if she is on the property.</p>
<p>Look after yourself. It doesn;t sound as if your daughter is ready to make any changes for herself. You can’t let her drag you and younger siblings down with her.</p>
<p>OP… please read this article. While there are some differences in symptoms, the way to go about approaching the situation (helping yourself first) is spot on.</p>
<p><a href=“http://www.moxiemagazine.com/featured-articles/133-through-hell-and-back”>http://www.moxiemagazine.com/featured-articles/133-through-hell-and-back</a></p>
<p>
</p>