My eldest is 22 - we have 5 kids between us. 21 and 20 are so far successful in college - 21 will graduate this spring. 20 is a sophomore and getting good grades. 17 is accepted at her school, 16 is weighing her options and taking ACTs etc. right now.
22 had a great deal at West Texas A&M in 2012 – she partied her way through freshman year (which she denies to me but tells other people), got tossed off the equestrian team for GPA and I brought her home at end of freshman year. She got very very few credits. And she owes a year of GSLs. 22 does have an LD for which she had accommodations but W Texas A&M was a school that was not at all a reach for her-- as a matter of fact she got significant scholarship (she did well in HS when she had a mind to do so and by jr/sr year she did). And yes she had ability to have the accommodations - she basically refused to help herself.
She took a stab at CC living with my ex - again, very few credits, lots of do-overs and no degree in site. She moved out with the boyfriend, again, took a few classes, switched concentrations to Vet Tech, then to X-ray Tech, then a few general classes - again, very few credits and many do-overs.
Falling out with boyfriend, I helped her move in with a friend (of mine - no rent and my husband and I helped her), she couldn’t get back to Vet Tech at either CT or NJ CCs (grades not good enough) and so she enrolled in an on-line program. She did a few classes, but hasn’t finished the first semester yet. She lost her job and moved back to Ex in CT – still doing the online Vet Tech online - well in theory as the first semester is still not done - she has 3 to go after that.
4 months into being back with my ex she now wants to live with her friend in an apartment-- historically she gets worse at completing school successfully when she doesn’t live with one of us (too many obligations on her time to make money-- she works as a Vet Assistant at an Emergency 24 hour hospital).
Ex and I said move and we are done with tuition – no more flushing $$$ into the toilet. I am less than happy to have her off in the world with ZERO education to speak of but she isn’t doing it ANYWAY. Sigh…
Any change the real world will snap her into reality??
toomany- big hug to you. This is certainly challenging.
Have you had any family counseling? I think you might benefit from having a neutral mediator hear her side of the story (I’m sure she has one) in a controlled setting.
I don’t think the message to your kids is ever “no more”. Sometimes it’s “not right now”. Maybe you can all agree on a path forward for the next 12 months- she keeps her job as a Vet Assistant and figures out a pay for whatever lifestyle she can afford. Then you sit down again and review/talk.
You may need to remind her (again and again) that she is an adult. You respect her boundaries; she respects yours. You love her and will never leave her homeless. But paying for an apartment and continuing to fund and on-again/off-again college degree is not something you are prepared to do right now. But you love her and want to help her sort her life out so she can support herself in a career that interests her.
She goes to a counselor in CT-- her father is going with her tomorrow and is going to tell me how that goes. I live in southern NJ with her sisters and my husband. Unfortunately the story she tells us is that the counselor says the issue is ALL US - not her, she is mature and responsible and if ONLY her father and I would be more SUPPORTIVE she would be JUST FINE. Her story to us is that we made her go FT, we made her take this or that – all not true or at least her bent version of the truth.
It is pretty hard to work with that level of drinking one’s own kool aid. No relationship is a one way street and any counselor who knew the truth of the history here would most assuredly acknowledge to her why her parents would be frustrated at this point. So she is clearly either not HEARING the message or conveying to us what she wants us to think (which is a fairly ridiculous assertion on her part).
I did MAKE her take a certain class one time after many failures-- it was one because she couldn’t handle more at that time successfully and it was something I knew she could pass with a good grade - I was trying to HELP her gain some confidence and momentum.
The problem is my ability to pony up tuition for her is running up against time - I am 53 with zero retirement (lost it all to my ex in my divorce) and two other daughters going to school. She kind of used up her turn.
Family counseling isn’t one person in counseling and then telling the parents what the counselor allegedly thinks or doesn’t think. It’s ALL of you in the same room hearing the same narrative with a guide who gives you time to react to outrageous claims.
Or- just agree with her counselor. She is in fact mature and responsible. And you and her dad are now going to be so supportive that you’re telling her “go with our blessings”. Sign a lease, get an apartment, take classes or not. We love you. Let us know how it’s going. If you decide you need or want our help with any of your professional goals let us know and we can revisit the plan and agree on terms, course of action, etc. But she’s mature and responsible- so she is free to do what she wants right now. Have fun.
I wasn’t trying to say it was family counseling – just that she is clearly askew on what is going on there and it not getting positive out of it-- I will be interested to see what my ex says after she and he and the counselor sit together and talk.
And we did say that about moving - but she wanted us to continue bank rolling her, and when we said that isn’t okay with us-- and then she flipped out. On your own is on your own
Sorry you are going through this, we are in similar boat. Our S lost a full tuition scholarship his freshman year due to poor grades. He came home attended the local state U for a semester, switched to local CC, never did well, we closed our wallet and has been working at a pizza place since. Smart kid (you don’t get a full tuition scholarship without smarts), did well in HS, great SAT scores, loves to learn, but hates doing tedious work. Had him tested and he has issues with EFD. He is not interested in seeing anyone about it though. We have told him he has a year to find a job with benefits, start training in the trades and get going with his life. Good kid, doesn’t give us any problem, but needs to take the next step. Best of luck with your D.
Would it help to make this more about finances and “fairness” with her siblings? If so, make a list of how much you’ve spent on her education thus far - general numbers of tuition, etc. Let her see how much you’ve spent to date and remind her of her sisters and their need for an education. If she still thinks it’s unfair, I don’t think any amount of logic will get through to her.
Would her dad be willing to take on her educational costs, with some kind of agreement on what she has to do to be supported? Maybe if he uses what you’ve learned he can help her make progress
I have seen first hand how some kids need a dose of the real world (and time to mature) in order to appreciate a college degree. You’ve given her many chances and set your financial boundaries -which IMO are reasonable. You can’t just keep paying tuition without progress or feeding the “drama”… She needs to experience the consequences of her choices and time to mature.
If she wants to move in with a roommate, let her get a job and pay rent/bills for the whole year. I bet after a year of that she will have a new perspective towards school. Big Hug!
@JustGraduate I’m going to try that. I did say a few month ago she needed to finish with her sisters now about to go. But yes I think the numbers may be in order at this point.
@runswimyoga thank you… She was very hostile about having to pay for everything like her $20 dr visit copays. I told her that’s being an adult – she keeps telling me she is one.
It sounds like you need family counseling as suggested up,stream. Everyone in the same room…at the same time.
If she wants to move out and be independent…fine. If it were me, I’d tell her that she can also expect to have to earn her own money to pay living expenses…and all other costs. That’s what independent, grown ups do.
It sounds like you and the other parent are on the same page with regard to supporting this 22 year old.
It’s not going to be easy. I agree…it’s not a forever thing. You can say that when she is ready to enroll in college again…you will pay for any courses where she gets a B grade or better.
Jumping ahead a bit, IF you are inclined to fund any later educational opportunities I’d make her front the $ and pay her back after completion of the course with a specified grade (like B or better). Make her have a lot of skin in the game, especially given the # of retakes she’s apparently had
Don’t mean to imply you should spend any more on her (esp given her siblings needs) but just a suggestion if you do feel it necessary
Would it help at all to think of this as a practical matter, not personal? Instead of framing it as flushing money away, can you think of it as “we only have x to spare, given everything we as parents are responsible for. So while we won’t let you be homeless, we need to be done paying tuition.” Try to distance yourself from the decision, if at all possible.
This seems really hard, but whether you are happy about her being in the world without more education or not, she’s the one with the choice. Not you. Financial backing doesn’t equal decision-making, and she seems to be telling you that in many ways. Maybe more time in the world will get her ready to have a plan or see a path, but you have no way to know. So if it were me, I’d agree with her on what she needs for rent support, do that for some specific time (a year?) and then go back to treating her like an adult, Learn to say “oh, I wish I could, but that’s what we agreed to” when she wants other stuff. Or don’t. There’s a LOT of pressure on parents of these non-launchers to DO sometihing, and make it punitive, but it’s also okay to set your own boundaries and give her what you are comfortable with. You know her best. Also, feel your own grief, own it, over what didn’t happen. How she didn’t choose. It’s okay to be sad, disappointed, scared and worried. But plenty of people struggle and then take off. Hang on.
I think you need to close your wallet for now. Having your parents pay for endless amounts of higher education with nothing to show for it is not a right. Living with your parents support forever is not an entitlement.
If it were me I would do the following:
If she wants to live in an apartment she has to figure out a way to pay for it herself. If she can't afford it she can move in with one of her parents.
Agree to pay for classes of her choice but only after she passes. She should pay on her own credit card, pay the interest and be reimbursed when she passes. I would define passing as that is counts for credit for whatever degree/certificate she is seeking. Make the bar attainable but put the ball in. her court.
Let her decide but you don’t have to go broke supporting her forever.
In answer to the OP’s original question, whether there is a chance the “real world will snap her into reality,” I have to vote YES on that one! Our situation was a little different in that our daughter dropped out of college in the second semester of her junior year, with no warning or discussion. We were so angry that, in reaction, we told her that no more money was coming her way from us. She was so set on working and supporting herself, so she could have at it! Well, within 2 weeks she had a (low paying) full-time job and moved into a living arrangement that she could afford, and ever since she has matured and become self-sufficient and very financially savvy and frugal. I know that is just one example, but I believe that it was having to fend for herself and deal with the “real world” and the consequences of her choices that helped my daughter mature! I think that’s the main point, we all have to deal with the consequences of the choices we make, and if we keep shielding our kids from that, we’re not helping them grow up.
She is 22 right? An adult by all measures. I personally feel that you should cut the apron strings, financial and otherwise. You should not be paying for college after her many chances. You should not be putting a roof over her head unless she is showing some serious signs of attempting to enter adulthood, in which case she would be working at least full time, preferably full time plus another job (or night classes that she is PASSING), and definitely contributing to the household by way of rent, paying for her own cell phone, vehicle/gas/insurance, etc. Even then, I’d have a deadline for her to move out. Some kids just have to learn the hard way.