<p>Oh, come now. We’re not talking about grabbing a bite to eat with people working on a common project and opening the conversation by talking about your fears of abandonment or being molested as a child or other highly personal, private topics. We are talking about social chit-chat, about the weather, sports, music, the annoying construction on campus, things of that nature. The fact that the OP either cannot or will not (it’s still not clear which) engage in light-hearted, casual conversation is a problem. A huge one. </p>
<p>You don’t have to be outgoing and you don’t have to be the life of the party to be able to have a pleasant cup of coffee with someone. Part of the problem is that the OP seems to equate this kind of conversation all the way to “partying non-stop and not paying attention to academics.” There is no one whose work is so all-encompassing that they can’t stop and have a meal with others. In fact, it’s not healthy to be eating alone on a regular basis, IMO.</p>
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<p>Again, no one’s studies are so all-encompassing and so all-important that they can’t be interrupted for a few minutes of “hi, how are you, what’s new” with friends and relatives.
If the OP cares. But I suspect he doesn’t care about his relatives and parents’ friends, because to him they’re “boring.”</p>
<p>OP - do you engage in things like Thanksgiving dinner, Christmas dinner (or other holidays - I don’t know your cultural background and don’t wish to presume) with your relatives? How are your interactions there, and what is the experience like?</p>
<p>This is an opinion, not fact, and you are projecting your own values on the OP. While, of course, there are benefits to having the ability to engage people in chit chat, they are not so fundamental to the human experience that some people cannot live perfectly happily without them. There are plenty of people lacking in these skills who have successful careers, especially in the sciences. By your assessment, people with Asperger’s, for example, would be doomed to miss out on life if they could never develop these skills.</p>
<p>Like most all parents, it is really important to me to see my Ds engage socially and I feel great that they have lots of friends at college, but it is because I know that is important to them and they want relationships. But I recognize that not all people do. A minority apparently can live just fine without that kind of “light-hearted and casual” conversation. Again, the spectrum of human personalities is far more extensive than most people experience in their daily lives and I don’t think anybody, including psychologists, has a right to set the standard on what is normal.</p>
<p>Unfortunately, Temple Grandin’s parents didn’t get to make that choice. And neither do the rest of us. From what Majjestic has told us, he will never be a “normal” social person. That’s not a choice on offer. What he needs to figure out is to what extent he nevertheless needs to engage the social world. </p>
<p>Majjestic seems to be saying here that he doesn’t need to engage the social world at all. I understand him to be asserting that if he stays in his room studying, never having a friend, never joining any kind of group of people, never learning the rudiments of social talk, he will be able to have a successful life by his lights.</p>
<p>I join with the rest of posters in saying that won’t work. Majjestic, we’re saying that you won’t get where you want to go doing what you are doing.</p>
<p>My guess is that OP´s parents probably thought it was perfectly normal when OP was younger for him not to go out or have friends. They were probably even doing a little dance because they were happy that they didn´t have to deal with teenage partying or sleeping around. Now OP is in college, the parents are getting the sense that maybe there is something not right. They are wondering if it is too late in trying to get some help for OP.</p>
<p>^^Sorry, I wanted to amend my use of the word normal in my post. I suppose it is acceptable to refer to the OP’s attitude toward socializing as not “normal” in the sense that it differs from the vast majority of people and hence the basic understanding of the word applies. </p>
<p>I guess I would rephrase to say that it is not up to anybody, including psychologists (or parents of adult children), to set the standards for what personality traits need to be corrected (unless, of course, those traits pose a danger to society).</p>
<p>There is a wide spectrum of being “normal.” People have their own level of human interaction they need. But it is not normal to have no interaction, unless there is some sort of disorder. In that case, then one doesn´t have a choice.</p>
<p>You could be right, oldfort, but as with all of us, Majjestic and his parents are where they are. We might as well assume that Majjestic’s parents tried to do what they thought was best for their son, like almost all parents. Maybe now they look back and wish they’d done something different, but we all have parental regrets.</p>
<p>The question is, what should Majjestic do now? Is he correct that he can continue as he has been going on and (1) his parents will put up with it and (2) he will achieve what he wants? I know that mathematicians and physicists tend to be less social, but are there examples of mathematicians and physicists who are as socially isolated as Majjestic says he is who nevertheless have successful lives? </p>
<p>Perhaps someone might name some mathematical genuises who were reclusive. Are there examples of any such people who were reclusive, but were not already recognized as prodigies at Majjestic’s age? I guess what I’m saying is, maybe someone can get away with social isolation if they are so extraordinarily brilliant that their intellectual contributions are obvious to those in their field-- but such people are extremely rare and their brilliance is already recognized by the time they reach their late teens.</p>
<p>^^Well, who determines the line between what is part of the normal spectrum and what is a disorder? I believe there is no line, just people that are further out than others.</p>
<p>Wildwood, I think you’re right that we can look at human behavior on a spectrum, with no bright line between normal and disorder. But we can look at an individual and ask, is that behavior working for him/her? </p>
<p>(We can also consider whether the individual’s behavior is so harmful to the rest of the world that society needs to deal with it, as in the case of happy psychopaths, but that doesn’t apply here.)</p>
<p>I read over the OP’s posts, and I have to say that it’s pretty likely that he is a ■■■■■. It’s too bad, because there might be some real people who have some of the issues that the OP pretends to have, and there’s been some good advice here.</p>
<p>Nobody who has spent any time reading other threads on the Parents’ Forum could have expected anything different from what the OP has been told. It’s difficult to believe that anybody who really thought the way OP claims to think would have come here for advice in the first place.</p>
<p>But on the off-chance that the OP is accurately describing his thoughts and feelings: yes, there is something wrong with you. You have a personality disorder, and should get therapy. Of course, if you’re just a ■■■■■, there is also something wrong with you, but it’s just being a jerk.</p>
<p>True. But so far all I have seen on this thread a people’s assumptions that his behavior is not working for him, based rightly or wrongly on the fact that his parents now think there is a problem. But the OP himself has indicated that he is capable of interacting with professors and people when he needs to. He doesn’t feel LOR’s are going to be a problem and he seems to have a good grasp on his situation. He is making a choice in his lifestyle and while I understand people advising him to reconsider that choice and the benefits of more social interaction, in the end I wish we could recognize that it is possible for him to be satisfied and successful if he continues on this path.</p>
<p>I don’t think the OP is a ■■■■■. Or if he is, he’s a ■■■■■ who is good at mimicking a certain kind of person who actually exists.</p>
<p>I’m going to resist the temptation to diagnose on the Internet, but consider these points:</p>
<p>1) He engages in black/white thinking: When he has a disagreement with his parents, they are “very bad parents.” Any student who engages in social chitchat is a drunken partier. </p>
<p>2) He is most interested in math and physics.</p>
<p>3) He doesn’t get social chitchat. He doesn’t know how to do it.</p>
<p>4) He doesn’t have any friends and doesn’t want any.</p>
<p>5) When his parents ask him about his life, he deems them “nosy.”</p>
<p>6) He would like to have a family eventually, but doesn’t think that is “realistic” for him.</p>
<p>Certainly there are other people with these same traits.</p>
<p>Without any kind of judgment or diagnosis, let’s talk about where you are on the continuum of liking to socialize or not liking to socialize. We are all somewhere on that continuum. </p>
<p>Take my husband and I. When the kids were little and he would take them to dance, he would sit and chat in the waiting room with the other parents. There are moms who he runs into to this day who remember their waiting room chats from 10 years ago.</p>
<p>In constast, when I would take the kids to dance, I would bring a book. I was not miserable in the least - I enjoyed that time to sit and read! And I am not bothered at all that he made all kinds of waiting room buddies and I didn’t.</p>
<p>So obviously, he is on the more social side of the continuum than I am. And OP, I would place you even further down on the scale than I am. As someone who is not all that social (I could live the rest of my life without going to another cocktail party), I can understand being content to not being with other people.</p>
<p>But as others have said, interaction is pretty much necessary for adult employment. I just finished reading one of Temple Grandin’s books. I think that at least early in her life, she would have been content to not have social interactions. But, she is in a line of work where she needs people to hire her for projects. She admits that she had to have help learning to dress in an appropriate manner, learning basic hygiene, etc. I’m not implying that you do - I’m just saying that without other people, her career probably wouldn’t have gone anywhere.</p>
<p>Here is what I suggest. Find one or two outside activities where you do something with other people. Hiking club, robotics club, Bible Study, Habitat for Humanity build, whatever interests you. Go to do the activity. Don’t go to an event that requires small talk…don’t go thinking “I will go to make friends.” Just go do some activity that you enjoy, where other people are doing the same thing with you or alongside you.</p>
<p>Just logged on to read this thread and am surprised the poster has stayed on as long as he has. The fact that you have stayed sounds like you are searching for some type of advice or you would have stopped posting by now. You are obviously very dedicated to your studies but you seem to be concerned with why you are being perceived the way you are. You say that you don’t care but on some level you must or you would not have responded to so many posters. I understand that you perceive your work as very important and the world does need people who think as you do, but there is a way to add to your own life even in some minor ways. It would not hurt to find a good therapist who could offer some ways that you would be comfortable with. If you are on the spectrum there is no reason your life can’t be made more enjoyable by trying some new things…heck all of our lives could be made better if we really listened to how people perceive us. You have nothing to lose and could only gain so rather than closing off to some suggestions that have been made consider it as yet another thing to explore.</p>
<p>As for your parents, they don’t sound like “bad” people they sound like they they are recognizing something that could, if you put the time in, may pay off in some way. This is really up to you as you are the only one who can decide to do something about this. I hope that you might consider the suggestion.</p>
<p>I was wondering what program you were in. Don’t worry about what your parents think. They are well-meaning, but they either don’t get it or you are not presenting your situation the right way. Usually, when in a taxing program such as yours, people may become friends with people who are similarly engrossed with their studies. They may not “party” on the weekends like others, but usually there are study breaks of some kind (occassional coffee break.) I don’t know if this describes you. Perhaps, the fact you have a job makes even that difficult.</p>
<p>OP, can you see a distinction between people engaging in social chitchat about sports, music, weather, and “light” details about their personal lives (where they are from, # of siblings they have, etc.) … and people who are not academically focused drunken partygoers? Or are they all the same to you?</p>
<p>Am I the only one who wonders which school is one of the best in the country, but where most upper division students in the OP’s major live at home? At the top schools I’m familiar with, most students are not local, so couldn’t possibly live at home.</p>
<p>Why are we focused on whether OP can make small talk with others or find occasional reason to devote time to them- dinner or chitchat with the neighbors? Maybe he really does find that sort of thing boring. He claims to have social skills he can pull out at will, when someone or something deserves them.</p>
<p>Problem: the thread is all about his self-justification. I’m having trouble finding a “satisfied” kid, just trying to get his work done without useless interruptions, a kid looking for ideas to appease his parents. It seems different than those of us who, at times, prefer our own company. Or, who get so involved in work that we set aside play. It’s a person needing an outlet. Or a target. That’s where therapy comes in.</p>
<p>Btw, I think some here have projected their own good intentions on the parents. We don’t know if they are kindly, concerned, gentle beings. But, even if they are the worst sort of wrong, meddling sorts, willing to impose every sort of concern- even if- that does not justify OP’s anger here and using some posters as targets.</p>
<p>I had a narcissistic relative who could justify every outrage. She was quite satisfied and quite successful. And, quite damaging.</p>