<p>Please those statistics are obviously bull, because I do go to an Ivy League and my grades are not faltering and neither are my black friends. And hell ya AA helped us get in. And it will help us get what we deserve in life. Without it do you think that top schools would even consider letting black people in? No, we were shut out of achieving. Proponents of AA realized that in order for one to succeed in the US they would have to go to a college with a name, like Harvard or mine, Cornell. Black people were disadvantage because they had a poor school system and because they could not pay to be tutored in the SATs so could not meet the same standards as white people. And this was all because of America's racist history. </p>
<p>Your data actually says that black people are in fact not smart enough to go to schools like Harvard and succeed. Is that what you are trying to say? Is that the kind of message you like, that we do not deserve to got to Harvard, but we can take what is considered a left over instead and try to get by? If it is then you've just insulted the entire Black population.</p>
<p>Affirmative Action In education and in the work place</p>
<p>In Motion Magazine: Is there a difference between affirmative action struggles in education and affirmative action struggles in the workplace.</p>
<p>Ren</p>
<p>@whatisinaname</p>
<p>"It doesn't matter what kind of reform the Romans did for the people, what matters is that they actually cared about the needs of the people. Our society obviously requires social reform in the form of welfare."</p>
<p>That's completely illogical. You say that though the Romans didn't use welfare, they cared for the needs of the people, but they go on to say that we don't care about our people, and instead of simply doing what the Romans did (if we really didn't care about our people, which is totally untrue), we need welfare.</p>
<p>"Why should America give Jewish people welfare because of a crime they did not commit?"</p>
<p>America should absolutely not give Jews (which is not a racial slur, BTW) welfare because they're Jewish, nor should it give blacks welfare because they're black. Also, elite schools in the 20s established racial quotas against Jews, anti-Semitism was widespread, e.t.c.; if you're saying that welfare is meant as rectification for past wrongs, then some should at least go to Jews and Asians, no? Heck, why not just give everyone welfare? I'm sure all groups suffered some form of discrimination in the past. You can't use racism as justification for affirmative action unless you're willing to apply the same standards to all stigmatized groups.</p>
<p>The bottom line: affirmative action is disgustingly racist. When you use it to advantages some groups, other groups are inevitably disadvantaged, and thus a vicious cycle of racism is perpetuated.</p>
<p>"In this country people are still denied jobs or promotions because of the color of their skin."</p>
<p>I'm sorry, that's simply not true.</p>
<p>"And the ancestors of Mexicans not being from this country? WHo do you think own CA, TX and lot of the Southwestern USA before Spain and then America stole it?"</p>
<p>Quiz question: which ancient indigenous Mexican group brutally slaughtered and subjugated other Mexican tribes?</p>
<p>a) Aztecs
b) Spanish
c) French
d) English</p>
<p>That's what I thought. Maybe we should do DNA testing, and if you have any Aztec blood, you'll be blacklisted from institutions of higher education ;). Sound good?</p>
<p>"Please those statistics are obviously bull, because I do go to an Ivy League and my grades are not faltering and neither are my black friends. And hell ya AA helped us get in."</p>
<p>I do love personal anecdotes, but the facts don't support you:</p>
<p>At the University of Virginia, blacks have double the chance of failing out as do whites; this pattern is repeated elsewhere. This is the fault of affirmative action. If it were eliminated, the gap would close instantly, as people would be admitted without regard to race.</p>
<p>Wow, I guess, i guess you're right. Black people are dumb and we shouldn't have tainted the doorsteps of American opportunity with our low SAT scores and welfare stealing selves. WHITE POWER! White power all the way!</p>
<p>That's all I hear from your posts. Go put your hood back on and burn a cross. You don't make sense and you've obviously been taught to think in such a close-minded way. We do not need your kind in the future of this country. Let me go to me Ivy League school that I did not deserve to get into, and sit in on lectures that my simple black mind will not be able to understand, and then when i do get that degree let me get that top investment banking job because you know "they do not discriminate because of skin color in America. Everyone has an equal opportunity". Certainly the job will not go to the white CEO's nephew, that never happens in such a free country like America. I'll cruise through life and do well , but only because of the undeserved help I will get from white people.</p>
<p>NOT!</p>
<p>I'm moving on from this imbecile.</p>
<p>aristotle 1990,
In this country people are still denied jobs or promotions because of the color of their skin."</p>
<p>I'm sorry, that's simply not true.</p>
<p>Are you kidding me!! Are you saying that blacks have equal opportunity in getting jobs in the U.S.!! If you honestly believe that then you are delusional.. If blacks are able to get high-paying jobs and get admitted into top colleges without AA then why does it (AA) exist? Blacks are underrepresented in almost all high-payingl professions. For you to say that this is not true displays how sheltered and naive you are about the realities of American society.
whatsinaname, I totally agree with most of your beliefs. Except aristotle is not a racist (or KKK member lol). He is simply sheltered from black society and therefore has fanciful, incorrect notions about blacks and what they can achieve. </p>
<p>Back to the original question. I agree with all of the ideas mentioned...I also want to add: eradicating all rap music videos portraying African American women in a negative light, whether visually or lyrically and promoting the importance of education in black media</p>
<p>This is a tricky question. As much as I don't buy into the concept of black unity, we (blacks) can only improve ourselves. However, each of can do the following...</p>
<ol>
<li><p>Not allow individuals who watch way too much T.V. and cannot differentiate between reality and fiction define who you are just because of your skin color. Just because you're black, doesn't mean you're on welfare (most welfare recipients are white and children BTW), poor (most blacks are not poor :eek:), or unitelligent.</p></li>
<li><p>Not let these same individuals trick you into believing that you do not deserve to be at whichever higher educational (since most of you are still in high school) institution you end up matriculating. Usually these people lash out against you because, they were not good enough to gain admittance to the college of their dreams, but haven't reached the maturity level to realize that their dream school didn't ever want them or just did not have space for them.</p></li>
<li><p>If you are the child or grandchild of African or Carribean/West Indian immigrants, do not fall into the trap of being racist against American Blacks. I read this forum yesterday, and some of you sounded like card carrying members of the Ku Klux Klan.</p></li>
<li><p>Stop believing that any genre of music, film, television show, or literature is the cause of your own or your counterpart's behavior. Adults are responsible for their own actions period. If those actions are illegal, then a judge will surely say this at sentencing.</p></li>
<li><p>Ladies stop believing that any rapper's or singer's lyrics are disrespectful or degrading to you. They are not referring to you, or any of your family or friends in their songs. Have a better sense of self-esteem than that.</p></li>
<li><p>Not fall into the trap in which many people (including some blacks), believe that if your first name deviates from the norm, you will be permanently disqualified from ever having a job. By such reasoning, Secretary of State, Dr. Condoleeza Rice and media mogul Oprah Winfrey would just be ignorant "bamas" who went nowhere in life. ("Bama" is a slur word referring to people from the rural South. derived from the state "Alabama")</p></li>
<li><p>Not look down upon anyone who has less than you. Too many people get ahead and forget that they are still, on average, two paychecks away from being homeless. A sudden injury, or even death of a primary provider can send a middle class family into destitution.</p></li>
<li><p>Realize that the road to success is long and arduous.</p></li>
</ol>
<p>Why must every thread on this site dealing with minorities, turn into an AA battle? </p>
<p>Back to the previous question. I think that everyone needs a role model whether an uncle, Denzel Washington(he hasn't done anything bad that I can think of), Oprah. </p>
<p>Also, sometimes I hear when someone who is black but studies or gets good grades being called white. Black women are statistically much better students than black males, that needs to be corrected ASAP.</p>
<p>On AA: </p>
<p>Despite its flaws, it's a well-intentioned system and I believe its benefits outweighs its harms. It helps diversify the educational and the professional fields and fills them with qualified people from all backgrounds. It may shaft Asians but so many of us are one dimensional (800 M SAT, math/science awards up the wazoo, computer science club president, prospective major [enter science/math/engineering field here] and pre-med) and I feel that the Asians who diverge somewhat from the stereotypes tend to do very well in undergraduate and graduate admissions. Hearing some random Asians gripe over AA and "omg, this URM with an SAT 200 points lower than mine and class rank way below me got into Harvard and I got rejected" really disgusts me.</p>
<p>On the topic:</p>
<p>The rap and hip-hop that promotes the bad-boy gangsta packing major heat and getting it on with their women (who are certainly negatively portrayed as well) has got to go. It promotes negative stereotypes in the eyes of non-blacks and promotes black youths to follow through with those stereotypes.</p>
<p>EDIT: koolmaria put up some nice points</p>
<p>Holy crap, I didn't realize that in the time it took for me to type that post up 2 more were already on their way...</p>
<p>good points, constantillusion, but the media is always going to define the people they portray. That's just the way things are.</p>
<p>Also, don't single out Africans/Caribbeans as discriminating against Black Americans because they do the same to us. I'm not saying all but there are a few too many that do. Reread that thread and you'll see that.</p>
<p>Also most people in poverty are white, but that is because they are, by far, the majority of the population. Proportionally, there are more Black people in poverty against those who are not as opposed to the number of white people in poverty than those who are not. If that makes sense at all. I do not know if most Black people in this country are impoverished, but I do know that there is a higher proportion of them than white people.</p>
<p>"Why must every thread on this site dealing with minorities, turn into an AA battle?"
I think because the majority of CC posters are white (and therefore cannot really relate to minority's problems) and love to find a thread to gripe about how AA is unfair, disadvantageous, etc. to them.</p>
<p>"If you are the child or grandchild of African or Carribean/West Indian immigrants, do not fall into the trap of being racist against American Blacks. I read this forum yesterday, and some of you sounded like card carrying members of the Ku Klux Klan."
Yeah, immigrant blacks can be racist towards American blacks BUT the racism is reciprocal. When I first immigrated here, my black classmates made fun of my Nigerian accent and short, "nappy" hair. My Nigerian friend is called "African" dark by many black Americans.
This brings up another problem that most be alleviated in black America:the disunity. Not just amongst immigrants and American blacks, but all of black society. The same slave mentality of favoring blacks with lighter skin over blacks with darker skin must be eliminated. Racism within the black community occurs incessantly. I is promoted by the media (how many light children with unappy,"good", hair do you see in advertisements?) </p>
<p>To solve this maybe the media and other outlets should have black child models of every color (dark, medium, light) to show the diversity in the black community. Because believe it or not, children are influenced by what they see on TV, and if they only see black children with European features, they will see that as the norm. This notion might lead to self esteem issues in children.
Proof: On Oprah a young woman who reconducted the classic baby doll test (about one hundred young [ages 4-6] black girls had to pick between a doll with African facial features and a doll with European facial features) found that the results were the same in as they were in the early 1950's: most of the girls chose the European dolls.</p>
<p>I love this thread! It is a great way for all of us (blacks and whites) to discuss problems openly and honestly!!!</p>
<p>Laptoplover, same thing happened to me! you and what'sinaname posted while I was typing!! lol.</p>
<p>
[quote]
Wow, I guess, i guess you're right. Black people are dumb and we shouldn't have tainted the doorsteps of American opportunity with our low SAT scores and welfare stealing selves. WHITE POWER! White power all the way!</p>
<p>That's all I hear from your posts. Go put your hood back on and burn a cross. You don't make sense and you've obviously been taught to think in such a close-minded way. We do not need your kind in the future of this country. Let me go to me Ivy League school that I did not deserve to get into, and sit in on lectures that my simple black mind will not be able to understand, and then when i do get that degree let me get that top investment banking job because you know "they do not discriminate because of skin color in America. Everyone has an equal opportunity". Certainly the job will not go to the white CEO's nephew, that never happens in such a free country like America. I'll cruise through life and do well , but only because of the undeserved help I will get from white people.</p>
<p>NOT!</p>
<p>I'm moving on from this imbecile.
[/quote]
Please. If you can't look at the data objectively, you shouldn't be in this conversation.</p>
<p>The Law School story was broken by the New York Times. Oh, that dirty conservative newspaper. Please.</p>
<p>Payne, I don't know how she can be objective if the data is totally racist and insulting to the black population. Maybe you should tell the same thing to the person who posted the data. Also everyone has a right to be in this thread, no matter how they express themselves.</p>
<p>
[quote]
Payne, I don't know how she can be objective if the data is totally racist and insulting to the black population.
[/quote]
The violent crime rate among blacks is more than five times the white rate and more than 10 times the asian rate. Can that be anything other than insulting? That's merely one of many related problems. We can make a laundry list of infavorable statistics. The vast majority insulting.</p>
<p>Data can not be racist, btw.</p>
<p>
[quote]
Maybe you should tell the same thing to the person who posted the data.
[/quote]
Perhaps true.</p>
<p>
[quote]
Also everyone has a right to be in this thread, no matter how they express themselves.
[/quote]
If someone reverts to ad hominem attacks, they should be kicked from the thread. Simple as that.</p>
<p>no it's a public board. And it's entertainment,to me at least, this is not a formal debate.</p>
<p>Oh, you think ad hominem attacks should not be policed? Laughable.</p>
<p>Is it just me or are most African Immigrants on CC Nigerians?</p>