<p>ReadytoRoll, I just think this counselor is way off base, and it looks like your son has certainly challenged himself even if he doesn’t have AP classes. I am going to send a PM to you.</p>
<p>I’ll ask him about AP Stats…but he got a very poor grade in calc this quarter. (B first quarter, B plus second quarter, B plus midterm, C minus this quarter…teacher said it’s because he rushes and makes stupid mistakes and thinks he will pull it up…but still…) I think he may be afraid of the AP courses!</p>
<p>He got a 630 in writing…both times…although his essay score went down the second time and his multiple choice score went up. Still waiting on the ACT writing score, although not sure whether to be sending the ACT in addition to the SAT or not.</p>
<p>ReadytoRoll - you don’t need Calc for AP Statistics - my D is taking it this year and is only in pre-calc (honors, but still not calc), and she is doing well. </p>
<p>I think people on this thread have given you some great advice. It would be really nice if your S could have a sit-down meeting with his GC, and go over his stats and what he’s looking for in a school - there are so many schools he’ll be able to get into, and I’m sure his GC could point him in the right direction - at least I hope so.</p>
<p>Ready- your kid sounds great. Really. </p>
<p>The counselor sounds like a poor match for all of you. We did not use a private counselor (our kids went to a private religious HS which had very strong guidance counseling) but we have a lot of friends who have- and in my mind the only good use of the outside counselor is where the parent/child relationship has become so fraught or poisonous that you need an outsider’s intervention. If you and your S have good communication skills and are able to navigate conflict well, this doesn’t sound like a good use of time and money. I know some of the counselors who frequent this board will disagree with me- but caveat emptor.</p>
<p>I hate to quote Dick Cheney here but I feel that I must- you go to war with the army you have, not the army you wish you had. Now is the time for you and your S (and the school GC if you can get her on board) to select a broad range of schools that meet the criteria (some more than others, some close by, some far away, some you’ve never heard of and some famous) and then figure out which of those are really exciting options, likely admits, tough admits, not affordable, etc. A couple you will toss out of no particular reason (“Arkansas? You’re not moving to Arkansas…”) and a couple he will toss for equally stupid reasons (“no way am I going to a school with a losing Lacrosse team, established by Episcopalians, which has a zebra for a mascot”). If you develop a long enough list now, it won’t matter that some of the schools never see the light of day.</p>
<p>It is unfathomable to me that a kid with the record of your son is considered a tough case by a private college counselor. I know kids with SAT’s hundreds of points below your son, with GPA’s not even in range who end up doing just fine in admissions. And no, they didn’t buy their way in. Your kid sounds great.</p>
<p>If it’s possible for him to keep an open mind on AP stats encourage him to do so. It is much less conceptual than calculus, and he may find it fun and not that hard to do really well in. Unless your school is quite atypical, the kids with SAT scores in math comparable to your son find it a cakewalk. </p>
<p>So don’t let him harbor unrealistic hopes… but he’s the furthest thing from a hard luck case that I’ve heard in a long time. And if he’s willing to go out of your region, his chances just get better and better.</p>
<p>Just curious, what are this counselor’s credentials? Anyone can call themselves a college counselor, everyone should remember this and take a hard look at credentials. </p>
<p>This counselor doesn’t seem to have the very basic understanding that at many state schools your son’s much higher than 75th percentile scores will compensate for the GPA.</p>
<p>After reading the first 2/3 of the posts I was going to say the counselor doesn’t deserve to be roasted. RtR’s son came in with his list which she evaluated. The best thing to happen would be to have come in open minded with to compare the person to the schools available (and use that list for safety, match and reach). The counselor is right that past data for schools doesn’t really indicate how acceptances will be. After seeing this year’s results (so far) I’m not sure what a safety is. However, based on RtR’s latest info on DS, it seems the counselor was not worth the fee, whatever it may have been.</p>
<p>RtR, I think you’ll get better info on good schools to target from here than you would from that counselor.</p>
<p>I will say that I haven’t read all the posts but if I had just gone by the numbers D would not have been accepted at Bates. She was sure that was where she wanted to go and applied ED. She is a high B low A student and is an IB candidate. She didn’t submit her SAT scores because she didn’t need to and they weren’t that good. Her HS GC indicated that is was a reach but to go ahead and apply. Why not if that is where she wanted to go. She was accepted ED1 and is very happy. It’s not all about the numbers. Many schools will actually tell you that the essay is very important. There are some great books that you can pick up at the library that really give you some ideas about what admissions people look for. You would be surprised. Once was written by an ex admissions person who worked at Duke. Very interesting read. It’s not all about the numbers. Sounds like this person is somewhat out of touch perhaps.</p>
<p>Thank you all for the AP Stats suggestion. I just asked my son…it had not even crossed his mind…and he was excited about possibly getting it on his schedule next year. The trick is, he needs his current calc teacher to recommend him and the deadline for enrollment passed. But…I sent a note to the teacher (who my son likes very much and will actually be asking to write a recommendation for him) and also to the guidance counselor asking if an exception can be made since he doesn’t have an A in calc. (You need to have an A in the previous year’s math class no matter what it is!)</p>
<p>I’ll let you all know…and thank you again!!</p>
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<p>Correct. You can learn everything you need to know for free by reading CC.</p>
<p>There are dozens, perhaps hundreds, of good colleges in the US that will be happy to accept your son. If the counselor doesn’t know that, or doesn’t want to tell you, there is something wrong with this picture.</p>
<p>Update…my son’s calc teacher (whom he loves…also had him for honors algebra II as a freshman…and incidentally my son was going to ask this teacher to write a college recommendation for him) has already replied to my e-mail, copying the guidance counselor and recommending my son for AP Stats. Now we need to hope she will let him in after the enrollment deadline.</p>
<p>Wow…all because of CC…</p>
<p>ok…good work…now, what about AP psych? that’s usually one that doesn’t require a previous class performance? that could be his social science for senior year.</p>
<p>Rodney…just asked him…we don’t have AP Psych at our school. Thank you for the suggestion though! He is taking Honors Latin next year though.</p>
<p>ReadyToRoll - glad that worked out for your S. Hope his GC doesn’t give him a problem.</p>
<p>You are on a roll ReadytoRoll! Good luck going forward. You’ve got a great son who will have great options by the time all these wonderful parents get “done with you.”</p>
<p>RTR, Glad to hear the calc teacher will advocate for the AP Stat class, and even better that your S is excited about taking the class! Seriously, hang around CC for a while. We had debated whether to talk to a college counselor with S2 (just the 1-2 hour consult), but DH realized I had picked up more useful info here that’s relevant to our family and S than any counselor, no matter how good, could provide in a short session.</p>
<p>That said, there are times when a counselor is appropriate (music/fine arts/MT programs come to mind). I’m just not sure it’s necessary here when there are plenty of fine choices for your S and he seems fairly flexible about what he wants.</p>
<p>I don’t see any reason for you to be paying for a counselor when you could figure out that information on your own. I think that by not wanting to return to the counselor, your son is saving your hard earned money.</p>
<p>I doubt that there’s anything that the counselor could do to get your S accepted to a big state university like Virginia, Michigan or Wisconsin – if that’s the kind of university he’s hoping to go to.</p>
<p>He may have a chance of getting into some large, lower ranked public universities.</p>
<p>One thing to keep in mind – given the fact that your S hasn’t worked up to his potential, do you really want to send him to a large public? Many of the large public universities have well-deserved reputations as party schools, and falling into hard partying, and then getting low grades could be something very tempting for a student whose grades haven’t matched his potential.</p>
<p>Saying this as the mom of an underperforming, very bright S who happily went off to a large public – with merit aid, too. He had a great time enjoying the sports and partying there, but didn’t go to class. He flunked out, and at age 25 hasn’t returned to college. Instead, he’s supporting himself and living independently in a low paying, clerical job.</p>
<p>Younger S --another bright, high scoring underperforming kid – took a gap year as an Americorps Volunteer after high school, and went to a tier 2 liberal arts college, where he has gotten good grades while working on campus and pursuing productive ECs that don’t seem to include hard partying.</p>
<p>Also if your son wants to go to top public universities, but needs a stronger courseload to boost his chances, I think your son should be expected to take on the major responsibility of trying to get into those courses. You’re doing lots of work for your son to make up for his lack of hard work. I suggest putting the ball more in his court. Right now, he’s acting like there was something wrong with the counselor when in reality it’s his own work ethic that has caused his chances to be low for his preferred colleges.</p>
<p>Okay, I’m off to bed…lol!</p>
<p>Northstarmom…I hear what you are saying. But what can I do for a kid that loves to watch sports and wants to go to a school where there are games to go to and lots to do (including Intramural sports/fraternities/other activities)? My husband went to an Ivy…not tiny but much smaller than what we are looking at I guess. He says that there was plenty of partying, and if you stopped going to class, no one was going to call you to find out where you were. Maybe at really small colleges they might nurture more…but I don’t see my son being happy at all in a tiny environment. It is a worry…but at the same time, I don’t know what a good solution would be. After seeing Penn State, he thought UConn seemed too small!</p>
<p>P.S. Not sure what kind of hard work I’m doing that isn’t what everyone else on CC seems to be doing! My son worked for five hours after school today, and then came home, studied for a test and then wrote a paper. (I think that’s more school work than he’s done all year…lol!) E-mailing the counselor was the least I could do!</p>
<p>Your S is upset that due to the fact that he has been underperforming, he may not be able to get into his colleges of choice. There’s an indication that if he takes a more rigorous courseload, he may be able to increase his chances of getting the admissions he wants. My suggestion is to have your S try to fix this problem by talking to teachers, the GC, posting on CC, etc. He is the one who got himself into this situation: He needs to IMO be responsible for getting himself out of the situation.</p>
<p>Right now, you’re making his problem your problem, and he seems to be trying to blame the counselor for the situation that your son’s academic laziness got himself into. </p>
<p>If he has to try to fix the problem, he’ll also come face to face with his own responsibility for his situation. For example, I imagine that the GC, teacher will ask him why they should make an exception for him, and they may ask him why his grades don’t reflect his high scores.</p>
<p>If your S can’t find the time to pursue a more rigorous curriculum, he will be demonstrating the same lackadaisical attitude that has reduced his chances for his preferred schools. If he therefore has to settle for a different college than he would have preferred, then he will be experiencing the natural consequences of his actions, and that may inspire him to act differently in college.</p>
<p>I’ve seen on CC many students who were rejected by their preferred colleges due to things like having high SATs, mediocre grades, after expressing their initial disappointment vowing to work up to their potential so that they could transfer to their preferred college.</p>
<p>Sometimes the best thing that we can do for our kids is letting them deal with the reality that they created. Not that many CC parents take this path, but it tends to be one that’s effective in waking our kids up about how slacking off leads to results that aren’t what they want.</p>