<p>I have applied to both USNA and USAFA. Though I am tripled Q’d at Navy, I have recently decided that USAFA is my first choice. I received a nom for Navy, and requested a VP nom for Navy and ended up requested Air Force Noms from my Senators. I am awaiting to hear the status of one of my senatorial nominations, and did not receive one from our other (Obama) Senator despite the fact that I am a very strong candidate. My ALO also says I am a very strong candidate and has recommended me for appointment, however there is only one Air Force slot available, according to the Senator’s liaison. I realize the committee nominates up to 10, and they go into a national pool, if not selected by the SA but given that this is an extremely competitive state, I doubt I will be in the top ten applicants for nom in the state. Should I contact Air Force and let them know I have the Navy Nom, and have requested the VP nom? I have been told that they are on occasion interchangeable (even though the MOC requires that you select only one SA), and I do not want it to appear that I did not qualify for any nominations.</p>
<p>Yeah, i got a nom from obama. they went out the friday before he resigned. and i have an appointment now so i think i might be taking his last spot, or whoever the new senator is. as an aside, thank goodness blagojevich wasn't able to sell away that senate seat. makes you proud to live in illinois huh? i know durbin and his board look over the nomination packets about this time of the month. His website stated they would start reviewing in early December. </p>
<p>I just had an interview with my Representative's office, and they said they would hopefully give out nominations by the end of the year. what district are you in?</p>
<p>and since the senators talk with each other they very rarely give out nominations to the same person. so in reality the top 20 or so candidates get senatorial nominations</p>
<p>MOC noms are not interchangeable. If you are saying you don't think you can get one of the 10 Senator slots, then you need to change your thinking! :) Desire is part of the equation. There are countless candidates that did not get accepted with stellar academics, athletics, leadership but did not get in while others with decent grades (though not top) DID get appointed. Why? DESIRE. It is a complex puzzle who gets in and who does not. The perfect academician may not survive the rigors of a SA - it is much more than a school - you have to have the academic aptitude to graduate but the academic composite is not enough ... determination is what graduates. Though academics are tough at many top schools, when you add in the extra stuff that the SA's deal with it is the well-rounded & determined student that succeeds. </p>
<p>Some MOCs will change your nom. They can (though they do not have to) easily do this IF they did NOT fill their AFA slate. IT IS A LONG SHOT; if they submitted their slate they MAY be willing to alter it. Don't be surprised if the answer is no ... if the answer is no, and the senator is also a no, your best bet is to update your file at AFA and push the desire button hard. Have you discussed this with you ALO? Does he understand that you don't have the nom? He may be able to intercede with the MOC (again, if willing). I am familiar with an instance when a B&G and ALO worked "together" with the MOC to "switch" noms. When you tell your B&G that you want to switch that nom you could end up with neither (B&G can discuss with USNA a belief that you would not accept and push for another to get that appointment as a result of you saying you want to switch your noms). If you are certain that you would NOT accept a USNA appointment if such were offered, then it is no loss - but if you would accept USNA then consider carefully how you play this. It is delicate to switch a nom from one SA to another. If the MOC did not submit a full slate to AFA then the staffer MAY be very willing to work with you and you wouldn’t have to discuss it with your B&G. </p>
<p>If you decide to talk to the staffer, I suggest you do so in person (make an appointment) and be very forthright. Most MOCs have SA’s handled in their district office but if yours in handled in Washington you can make a phone appointment. Many MOC offices simply won't deal with this issue while others will work with you - if they have time and are willing. It is not uncommon for a MOC to submit less than a full slate, even in competitive areas.</p>
<p>As to the VP, did you actually only apply for a USNA nom from the VP or did you also include USAFA? If you only applied for the USNA VP nom then you will likely be out of luck for a VP nom for AFA. However, if you completed the form for the VP nom & put both USNA & AFA then you may still be in the running for it.
<a href="http://www.whitehouse.gov/vicepresident/vicepresidential_nominationpacket.pdf%5B/url%5D">http://www.whitehouse.gov/vicepresident/vicepresidential_nominationpacket.pdf</a></p>
<p>Last suggestion - call AFA directly and talk to your admissions rep. Ask to discuss your file & what you can do to strengthen it. Explain that AFA is your 1st choice & if given the opportunity you would absolutely accept an appointment. Tell them that when the process began you were not sure between USAFA & USNA (that is very common and they know it) so you split your nom choices between the two. Now you are CERTAIN you want AFA but an AFA nom looks remote as your MOC required a choice months ago and gave you a nom to Navy. Ask if you can be considered for the prep school (shows desire). Express your interest ... If you know you are QQQ (you are at USNA so you likely are at USAFA too) then desire can set you apart from the others. </p>
<p>Hope that helped ... It's a tough situation - good luck. Remember, staffers are there to help - don't be tooooo intimidated by them! Typically the staffers doing the SA stuff really LOVE it and really WANT to help you to achieve your goal. If none of this works and you still really want AFA then try again next year. A lot of applicants have applied several times.</p>
<p>Thanks for all of the advice. It is certainly a tough situation and a bit out of my control at this point. I have a very good relationship with my ALO, and I think my first step will be to have her work with the academy on my behalf if I do not receive a Senate nom (which again is very unlikely, just based on the numbers). Unfortuantely I DID specify USNA with the VP nom, however, USNA would not be a bad choice, just not my first choice--Air vs Sea, etc..... I am fortunate though-triple Q's and a nom in hand.......</p>
<p>last year our friends son got the nom for the AFA (CO), he wanted the USNA, they called the MOC and because the USNA candidate wanted the AFA they were able to switch. The girl is currently at the AFA and he is a plebe at the USNA.</p>
<p>It can occur, but don't bank on it.</p>
<p>MY only pt is REALIZE either route you take you will owe 5 yrs back after graduation. If you are not keen on being on a boat, than take a long hard look at applying. If you believe that you will be happy in either service b/c you are going to fly...remember there are a lot of roads to travel before you earn your wings.</p>
<p>Go in the service you are willing to eat, breath and live for the next 9 yrs, don't just say well I got this one and not that one so I'll go there. I don't know many AF fliers who wantd to fly so badly that they were willing to live on a boat. I do know at least 3 fliers that did leave the Navy and join the AF. You will always wear the blues before the bag</p>
<p>Good luck</p>
<p>As far as VP noms go, once a particular academy is designated by the candidate who applies for the nom is it binding like it is with MOC's. Since the academies control the VP noms is it possible to have them intercede and change the nom request?</p>
<p>Also remember there is only 1 VP appt for ea SA, the chances are not high on getting it. A couple of yrs ago there was someone on the serviceacademyforums that received it. They already had appts to 2 of the SA's and this was how they got him in for the third. They stated that the VP came in very late, I think around May. The VP is usually used as a very last resort to get the cadet in.</p>
<p>Think about appts as a huge jigsaw puzzle, once all of the WCS's are in they have to move pieces around to get the best class in. I.E. in NC you can get 6 nom sources (Pres, VP, 2 Sen, Cong and ROTC) That means they can move you around more easily than someone from a state where the MOC's talk (CO I believe MOCs talk to ea other and do not duplicate the list), which could leave you with only 4 at most...harder to move them around.</p>
<p>I wouldn''t believe that the SA's would intercede...why should they? They are concerned about the best class they can have. If you wanted the AFA you should have asked for that not the USNA. I don't mean to be mean I just don't understand why you didn't ask for it.</p>
<p>Only 1 VP appt to each academy? I believe there are like 100!</p>
<p>No...the presidential is 100 appts with unlimited noms. Typically 400-500 noms are given out through the Pres. You also have to be a military child to receive one. There are more specifics re the military member, i.e. AD, retired, res, etc.</p>
<p>VP only has 1 appt. for ea USNA, USAF, and USMA. The VP is elgibile for US citizens and the VP doesn't determine who gets it, the SA does</p>
<p>I really have no experience when it comes to negotiating this. I am not from a military family, and while my parents are very supportive and have guided me as much as possible, we learning about the process together. That being said, my apps where done very early, and I knew I had to split my noms however, it did not occur to me that one or the other was going to give me an advantage. I requested USNA from my congressman and the VP and USAFA from my two Senators. One of the Senators is now our President Elect--all of his nominees are either recruited athletes or received LOA's (per his staff), I have not heard from the other senator yet, but my suspicion is it will be the same story as it is a very competitive state. Neither had interviews. I was invited to candidate visits at both academies recently and at that point it became apparent to me that Air Force was a better fit. I realize how fortunate I am to be tripled Q'd at Navy with a Nom in hand. I am just seeking advice from those who might have more wisdom then me.</p>
<p>First of all, let's go point by point.</p>
<ol>
<li> Thank you for wanting to serve our country</li>
<li> Getting a nom is something you should be proud of</li>
<li> It is understandable that after doing a visit you decided that the fit was better at one SA over the other...take the invitation as they want you...they don't invite the 9K pre-candidates to come, nor do they invite all of the 3K applicants. They invite people they are seeking</li>
<li> Is there a way you can go back to the VP nom and add the AFA...ask the regional, they should have an answer. The VP allows you to rank order what you want, to my knowledge it is doesn't stop you from asking for 3 VPs, just like the Pres.</li>
<li> Illinois is comp., but do you know if the MOCS coordinate. Obama's office could have taken 10 off the list, and Durbin could take 10 totally different candidates. This is not uncommon. They are trying to spread the wealth. Also Durbin could have 2 vacancies, meaning his slate could be up to 20 applicants.</li>
</ol>
<p>Finally, do you have an LOA from Navy, if so than talk to your ALO about trying to get one from the AFA. From there you might get a nom from Durbin and you're in. The military is hard to negotiate around, but if that dream is there you will find the way to get in. It might be prep, it might be ROTC and then re-applying, or just ROTC, but it will happen as long as you try to find the pigeon hole you fit into.</p>
<p>
</p>
<p>US Code says differently. It states that the VP gets 5 at the USAFA: </p>
<p>TITLE 10 > Subtitle D > PART III > CHAPTER 903 > § 9342. Cadets: appointment; numbers, territorial distribution</p>
<p>(a) Air Force Cadets are selected as follows:
<a href="2">b</a> Five cadets nominated at large by the Vice President or, if there is no Vice President, by the President pro tempore of the Senate.<a href="3">/b</a> Ten cadets from each State, five of whom are nominated by each Senator from that State.
(4) Five cadets from each congressional district, nominated by the Representative from the district. </p>
<p>Same exact language is used for USMA and USNA - 5 at each.</p>
<p>i just found out on my application i received a nomination from my congresswoman, i literally fell out of my chair. this should definitely help me with my final i have in 2 hours. quick question. so my application is just about done, just waiting for my finals to finish up so i can send my college transcript over. now that the academy knows i have a nomination, will this most likely help me chances in general? i know it kind of works vice versa when a congressperson knows you have an appointment they're more likely to give u a nomination, but does it work the other way around? granted that I have pretty decent stats with my cfa probably lacking a little.</p>
<p>My bad, I put the VP at the the same level/amount as MOCs. I should have said 1 per yr and no more than 5 at any given time. Way different than 100.
[quote]
I believe there are like 100
[/quote]
</p>
<p>Luigi - that would be 5 TOTAL. NOT 5 per year. Therefore the academies average one appointment per year for the VP.
Also, for the VP nomination there is no "slate of 10 nominees" like with the reps and senators.
If you get a VP nom it will be in conjunction with an appointment.</p>
<p>I don't recall posting anything about "per year." :confused:</p>
<p>Good clarification but in the context which PIMA wrote it - I think she meant one per year.
Not exactly right since there may be more than one in a year.
Most kids are thinking per year anyway and could care less about the total academy population.</p>
<p>Another point - if the academy offers a VP nom and an appointment to a candidate and that candidate turns down the appointment then they may offer the nomination and appointment to another candidate.</p>
<p>Well...a little bit off topic ish BUT I had my interview yesterday. It was alot shorter than I expected but it went fantastically. Haha they loved it when I said I eventually wanted to be the first Predator Ace haha ;)</p>
<p>I have a quick question. I received a LOA, and received nominations from my congressman and senator last week. What comes next? Should I be hearing from the Academy, or should I still be sending them updates (quarter grades, new honors....)? If anyone can shed some light on this, it would be appreciated. </p>
<p>Thanks.</p>
<p>You should be okay. Just wait. The academy takes a while to do paperwork, but it looks like you should be getting something in the mail pretty soon. :)</p>