<p>"For Freshman Headed Out of State, New York is Top Choice"</p>
<p>The problem seems to be keeping them there.</p>
<p>Interesting article. Recently read that U of Rochester has overtaken Kodak as the biggest exployer in the city.</p>
<p>Off-topic and just musing, but doesn't it seem like half the colleges in the US are located in just four states: New York, Ohio, PA and Mass...</p>
<p>...and California.</p>
<p>all this time I thought Rochester was in MInn ;)</p>
<p>Wouldn't Ct. also be in the mix?</p>
<p>Dudedad, I think I found a link for the article you menitoned:</p>
<p>Dudedad, you actually got me to go to the dictionary with "exployer" - if it isn't a new word, I think it should be.</p>
<p>Oops did a hee-hah at my unintended goof! Yeah Kodak and Xerox, the scaled down exployers...</p>
<p>The state of New York is working hard to revamp the SUNY system both in the quality of programs and student facilities which is may be another reason the state is now attracting more OOS. Governor Pataki has made higher education a budget priority. </p>
<p>Got you all beat here in Delaware. Well, if you look at corporate existence rather than minor details like physical presence . . .</p>
<p>I'd add that the SUNY system is also a rare bargain for out of staters -- the out-of-state tuition charges are quite moderate, so it is actually less expensive in terms of overall COA for many Californians to attend a SUNY than a UC campus. So for students from any state looking for an affordable education, the SUNY's are getting very attractive.</p>
<p>Calmom, well put. I think the number of students from California attending one of the great schools in the SUNY system, both for undergraduate and graduate programs, is quite high in relation to other states. They know a great deal when they see it!</p>
<p>I was curious about Ct. and found this fairly recent article in InsideHigerEd that sketches out several reasons why UConn and other higher ed institutions in Ct. don't attract large numbers of OOS, and when they do why the retention rate is so low.</p>
<p>As a New Yorker, I have a different perspective than that of Calmom and asteriskea. First, politicians always talk a good story about supporting education, but the story is always different when it comes to finding the resources. The SUNY schools have gotten noticeably worse over the past 10 years or so. The money has not been allocated to keep up with the growth. Faculty:students ratios have worsened and are now about 1:20. That is only part of the story since much of the full time faculty has been replaced with adjuncts and part time faculty. Some new faculty positions have been approved by the number is far short of what is needed. </p>
<p>The SUNY system has always been a political football. Many of the SUNY's are located in depressed and depressing little snowbelt towns many miles for any sort of culture or attractions that would interest a student. This has helped foster strong cultures of excessive alcohol and/or drug use. The best SUNY LAC is Geneseo. Geneseo is isolated and there is vitually no town, just a few bars and sandwich shops. I graduated from the best SUNY university - Binghamton. I can't think of anything good to say about the town of Binghamton. The school was academically ok, but the gray sky and endless snow and prison-like, instiutional architecture are pretty depressing. </p>
<p>The best thing about the SUNY schools is the extremely low tuition, especially for instate students. Even that might not be such a good thing, considering the economic pressures on the system.</p>
<p>SUNY Stonybrook is a rising school though. I can imagine a good number of out of staters attend, especially in the sciences.</p>
<p>4% of UG students are OOS. Stony Brook is about 50% commuters. Since the surrounding area is almost entirely suburban and white, the demographics are a bit unexpected. Only about 1/3 of students are white. There is a very large Asian component to the school among non-commuters due to the Asian cultural center and other donation from Wang of Computer Associates.</p>
<p>Since the SUNY system is made up of 64 different schools and there is no flagship institution it isn't that easy to point a finger at any particular one of them either to praise or denigrate the entire system. I could point out that SUNY Purchase attracts both New York and OOS student because of its excellence in the arts, as wel as the humanities - which compares favorably with other highly selective institutions in NYC as well as across the country. The reputation of mediocrity continues to plague the SUNY system despite substantial gains and improvement to campus facilities and programs across the board. In the case of SUNY Purchase, enrollment managers certainly recognize the need to improve the public image and brand name recognition of the institution to better reflect the college's committment to excellence and the distinctive programs the college has to offer potential students both in state and OOS.</p>
<p>That said, I do have to agree on a number of points with edad. Given the plain and simple reality of the "political football", much more has to be done to improve the SUNY system across the board - which obviously is in the interest of both New Yorkers and the state of New York. According to SUNY fact sheets, for every $1 of state funds spent on SUNY, the system generates about $8 in revenue. I would also think that the undeniable commuter atmosphere and lackluster local scene at many of the SUNY campuses does have a negative impact and most likely contribute to all the reasons why, according to the article, most OOS don't stay in New York.</p>
<p>Many public universities do have a week-end "commuter environment" especially when a large % of the kids live within a 3 to 4 hour distance from campus. So I do not think this is unique to a campus like Stony Brook. Last year, I never thought my d would be attending SUNY. "Too cold-too remote-too boring."<br>
We traveled along the mid-atlantic and checked out appropriate schools for the B average student. Mostly public U's as price was a consideration and we did not expect financial or merit aid.<br>
Visited Temple-Towson-George Mason- VCU- and a bunch of others.<br>
George Mason got a second look - but when all was said and done, my d was concerned that it too was too much of a commuter atmosphere and as an OOS kid, the campus would be pretty empty on the week-end. She heard similar things about Temple and some other schools --that too many kids go home on the week-end. She too wanted and deserved a full campus experience.<br>
So after all was said and done, we're heading to Suny Cortland this week-end for her freshman orientation.
Edad- from my Nassau County community, about 60% of my d's graduating class are going SUNY. I have to admit- the SUNY campuses looked better than I thought and the overall atmosphere at schools like Cortland-Oneonta-New Paltz were really very nice and had a lot to offer if you take full advantage of it. The college experience is what you make of it. And nothing is wrong in having some money left over for grad school.</p>
<p>NYU is the best</p>
<p>Due to the emphasis on music and performing arts, SUNY Purchase is indeed an anomaly in the SUNY system. </p>
<p>NYS has some great performing arts and especially music schools: Juilliard, Mannes, Manhattan School, and Eastman. It also has some more modest music schools such as NYU and Ithaca College. By comparison, Purchase is much more modest. I again attribute this to a lack of funding and lack of desire to build excellence into the SUNY system. The student faculty ratio at Purchase is again about 17:1 with a large portion of the faculty made up of adjuncts. When my D investigated Purchase a couple of years ago, she found there was not even an adjunct for her instrument. I just checked the Purchase webpage and confirmed that this is still true. Sorry but you just don't build a quality music program without instructors for all of the orchestral instruments. Some other statistics which indicate the quality of instruction at Purchase are graduation rates (about 1/3 for 4 years and about 1/2 for 6 years) and student SAT's (generally in the 1000's or 1100's for M+V). Those numbers are pretty modest even within the SUNY system. To it's credit Purchase does seem to be taking some action concerning illegal drugs and underaged drinking. For the past few years there have been several hundred arrests and/or disciplinary actions per year for these offenses.</p>
<p>I agree completely with Marny - the college experience is what you make of it and the schools in the SUNY system offer quite a lot to make not only a satisfying but exceptionally rewarding undergraduate experience that can also open impressive doors for grad school. I agree that in many ways SUNY Purchase may be an anomaly because of its performing arts program - and even pitted against stellar institutions such as Julliard and other Manhatten schools it stands up quite well. (Nobody is saying perfect.) Indeed, one of the reasons that the graduation rate is low is because so many Purchase undergrads in the program leave without a SUNY diploma, lured away by professional contracts and work opportunities before they graduate. I am not sure what is the problem with adjunct professors - maybe I am missing something here - this is precisely one of SUNY Purchase's strong points in the sense that the college taps into the incredible pool of artistic talent available in the Westchester-Fairfield area as well as NYC. While lack of tenured professors etc. might be an indication of a weak program in this case, I would not readily assume the quality of education was compromised in any way - but ultimately that kind of judgement is up to each applicant to make as they decide exactly what they are looking for in their undergraduate experience.</p>
<p>I checked the SUNY Purchase website - a quick glance at the department offerings in the humanities department and the list of tenured Ph. Ds from distinguished universities around the world is impressive to say the least. To judge the school merely on the basis of SAT range is misleading. Proximity to NYC also gives students access to the resources that New York has to offer as well as an oportunity to explore the cultural delights of the city. Westchester isn't exactly a cultural wasteland either - just expensive.</p>
<p>This is for those SUNY Purchase/NYU fans:</p>
<p>Edie Falco--Stanley Tucci--Adam Nagourney (reporter for the NY Times) all alumni of SUNY Purchase.
Al Roker- alumni of my alma mater-SUNY Oswego. I believe he did week-end work at the Syracuse TV station. Oswego is about 30 miles north of Syracuse. So even with the fancy schmancy "Newhouse School of Communication" at Syracuse, the TV station uses a kid from Oswego to do week-end work. I truly do believe it is what you make of the college experience. And a plus (IMO) of the colleges of SUNY (not university centers) is that there really is a good student to faculty ratio. There are few classes with more than 30 kids. And very few large lecture halls. The SUNY colleges really may have more of a LAC feel as the student population is at a very nice size -usually 5,000-8,000 kids at these campuses. Not too big and not too small.</p>
<p>That's a cute article.</p>