<p>I don't know. I think I agree with TheDad that small LAC + Greek has corrosive potential. It's fine if you're sure you want to participate - and will get in - but if you're not sure or don't get in, perhaps its better to look elsewhere sometimes.</p>
<p>At a smaller school, if 80% of the students are Greek and you're not, you don't have many people leftover to choose from if you want or need a non-Greek social life. On the other hand, if you go to a school with 10,000 kids and 80% are Greek, you have at least 2,000 people to socialize with. </p>
<p>So, the lesson learned is that evaluating how strong the Greek pull is on the social scene at smaller schools is probably more important than at larger schools (although I think it should still be considered then as well), especially if there's any chance you may not want to go Greek.</p>
<p>Are there really any schools that are 80% Greek?</p>
<p>(My son attends a medium sized university that has been accused on this board as being big into the "Greek culture". As a point of fact, less than 30% of the men join fraternities. That means that more than 70% of the men on campus are NOT in fraternities.)</p>
<p>Even though my d is a h.s. senior I gained alot from reading these posts.
Fredo- I would encourage your d to at least do the paperwork for a transfer. She can always decide not to go if accepted. As someone who graduated from a huge state school (and loved it) - I see many advantages for going that route. There are lots of people outside the greek system, many more opportunities to find different groups of friends, etc.</p>
<p>As far as everyone else who posted - I am so glad that there are a group of parents who feel comfortable sharing with each other that our kids are not all "mr & ms. popularity". My kids fall into that group too and I'm glad to know they are not alone.</p>
<p>My mom told me that my sisters( I have 3) and I used to call her, discuss all of our problems with her and then ,of course feel better. She was the one who would then have to stay up all night and worry. She said the worst night was when each of us called up crying about different issues one right after the other. She laughs about it now, but I don't think it was so funny then.</p>
<p>Hang in there Fredo - I was actually a shy kid who ending up running for a local elected office - and winning!</p>
<p>Sokkermom, it doesn't feel like one big sorority but even if it were, by that standard the label would be meaningless since it would be all inclusive.</p>
<p>D's first college visit, in 9th grade, was to Northwestern. Its high, something like 35 percent, Greek participation was a strike against it for her. In fact, that was probably the first generated reaction for her that was incorporated into her previously established search criteria.</p>
<p>35 percent is small you say? Not when the organized 35 percent often have a greater impact on campus life than the unorganized 65 percent. I'd actually lived in Evanston for a number of years so none of this was a surprise to me. (Seeing Northwestern was just part of going to see Dad's old home town, a low-stress introduction to visiting colleges.)</p>
<p>D had her fill of cliques and popularity contests from elementary school on. One of the things she liked about her junior and senior years was that people had started to loosen up and it didn't matter who was friends with whom.</p>
<p>Maybe it's genetic: both TheDad and TheMom were GDI's at their respective schools.</p>
<p>For upcoming parents and kids, something I figured out fairly late in the process:</p>
<p>Percentages that seem "moderate" when reading the college guidebooks, can actually have a huge impact on the nature of campus life.</p>
<p>For example, 30% in fraternities or 40% on varsity sports teams don't sound like a large number. But, if you think about it, that is such a sizeable chunk of the student population that can be a primary determining factor in defining the social life and culture of the school. With those percentages, you will, at the very least, start to see a polarization in the student body -- those who are and those who aren't. The Greek system carries an additional risk in this direction, because it is, by its very nature (rush, additional expense, etc.) exclusionary.</p>
<p>Any number above 50% is "off the charts" and you can be sure that the school will be dominated by that group or type of student.</p>
<p>There is less risk of this at large state universities where it is difficult to get dominating percentages of anything, due to the size of the student body. As the size of the school shrinks to private university size or even smaller to LAC size, you need to start paying attention to things that can define the character of the school. Don't gloss over these. Have some frank discussions about whether or not the student will be comfortable with that dominate majority or not.</p>
<p>Fredo, I wholeheartedly agree with one of your prior post, let her make the decision and then support that decision. She seems to be thing thought things through and that is what matters.</p>
<p>BTW, a number of my son's friends are transferring after frosh year and all are girls transferring from out of state colleges(1 public, 2 private) to state colleges(2 public, 1 private). And none are transferring for academic reasons.</p>
<p>It seems that all the boys in his hs group are liking their choices and adjusting well, whether in state or out of state.</p>
<p>I don't know if this is common or just coincidental. I suspect the latter.</p>
<p>DePauw, the school Fredo's D is at, is close to 80% greek. Other LACs with close to that number include: Rhodes, Albion, Allegheny, Millsaps, Trinity College, Wabash (Indiana), but there are many others as well. And, in my mind, it's not just the percentage that matters, but rather how much Greeks dominate the social scene. You can have 30% of folks in a Greek system at a small school in the middle of no where and have people feel excluded from social life if Greek life is pretty much all there is to do on campus and the Greek events aren't open to the entire campus.</p>
<p>My mom told me that my sisters( I have 3) and I used to call her, discuss all of our problems with her and then ,of course feel better. She was the one who would then have to stay up all night and worry. >></p>
<p>I think the size of the school really does make a difference along with the percentage. The school I went to, UMich, is, I think, about 30% Greek. But I was only fairly conscious of the existence of that world; it had nothing to do with me. No one I knew was involved. Never went to a frat party, never really knew when they were. There is so much to do on that campus, and in Ann Arbor, that outlets for social life were definitely not needed.</p>
<p>UMich is currently listed as 16% fraternity, 15% sorority.</p>
<p>A state university would be VERY Greek oriented to get to 30%. An example is UVa which is considered to be perhaps the preppiest state university in the country.</p>
<p>Fredo; large univeristies do offer more diversity, but they can be tougher for shy types. (Did you get a chance to scroll through buckeyemom's posts? Her D was having difficulty as an introvert at Ohio State).</p>
<p>That said, this doesn't sound like a situation which will improve. Perhaps you could support the transfer--with the caveat that she play in the band? (A built-in social group?)</p>
<p>(well done Garland--on the shizz bit, not the numbers bit)</p>
<p>How can a school that denies the chance to apply for admissions to at least 50% of the population (based on gender) be all "inclusive"? That seems to be an oxymoron, TheDad.</p>