<p>OK, now that the college app process is behind us, I need some advice about surviving senior year. My daughter is extremely extroverted, has millions of friends and loves to go out socially. In our state, 16 yr old drivers are legally only allowed to stay out until 11 PM, so we were OK for a while. Now that most of her friends have turned 18 (she's still 17), they have no curfews. Two weekends ago, my wife was out of town, I wake up at 1:30 AM and DD is still not home. Reach her on her cell, and she's at a "party" (I guess someone's parents were out of town) close to 30 mins. away from our home. She has been very responsible and has left unfavorable situations in the past, so I more or less trust her judgement. I am 97% sure she would not drink & drive or be with anyone else who would. We've also told her and her core group of friends (who are all great kids) that if they ever need a ride at any time, we will come pick them up, no questions asked.</p>
<p>When she got home from the aforementioned party, I told her she now has a curfew: midnight on weekends and 10PM on school nights. When my wife got home, she thought it was unfair since most of the times her friends, rather than her, are driving. I thought I stuck to my guns, but evidentally my wife and daughter saw it differently. I woke up at 1:15AM last night and DD is still not home. Woke the wife and she told me DD & her friends came home to watch a movie, dropped off her car, and went out again. Called DD and she was at local hamburger joint with her girlfriends consoling another friend who got rejected EA from Stanford. </p>
<p>OK, so what's reasonable? My feeling is that bad things start happening as it gets later, particularly after midnight. More drunks on the road, etc.,etc. What limits & guidelines have you set for your seniors? I know next year away at college will be another story, but I don't know if I can survive senior year.</p>
<p>Audiophile, In our minds and in our house, it is never o.k. to stay out beyond midnight. Period! We insist that our S wake us up when he gets home. That allows us to smell his breath and look at the clock. Another technique we have used is to set an old fashioned wind up alarm clock outside the door. If it goes off, he's in big trouble. My two cents.</p>
<p>There are really no good reasons for a high schooler to be out past mid-night. Too much trouble going on, drunks on the road, etc.</p>
<p>It's interesting,we were just having this conversation in my house yesterday.
Senior S has had his senior license for a little over a month as NY is 17 for that and he is a late birthday.We've been working on a midnight to 12:30 base(weekends), with phone calls for extenuating circumstances.We agreed that as the year goes on,we'll extend the time,and who can be in the car with him..right now its nobody or sometimes one passenger.Infractions mean loss of the use of the car.No joke too,hes a second kid so we've been there,done that....
By the end of the spring of their senior year we figure they need to know how to self regulate so they can be ready for that freshman year.</p>
<p>We have 4 Ds and none has ever had a curfew. To be honest, we've never had a problem with any of them. They have known that they should let us know where they're going and approximately what time they'll be home. We've never set a specific curfew time because, in my opinion, very few kids abide by a set time, all the time and it only leads to conflicts. Our girls haven't had a problem letting us know where they are, who they're with, and what time they're likely to be home, or if they need a ride. With the activities they've had through high school, there are more nights than not that they would have missed the curfew times stated here. They've all been very involved in theatre and sports and it's rare that they'd be able to make it home by 10 on weekdays or 12 on weekends, for much of the year. </p>
<p>I don't recall any of them ever being out beyond 1:30, except for midnight movie screenings. They've always respected the fact that when they come in, we usually hear them due to the chimes on our security system. Of course, now that the oldest three are in college, they come and go as they please when they're home visiting, although all still 'report' in to let us know their plans. Curfew issues haven't been a problem in our family.</p>
<p>we don't have a set curfew at our house either. i had one as a kid, and i never could convince my parents that if i was going to do something i shouldn't, it was just as easy to do it before midnight as after! </p>
<p>i do understand the concerns about safety and the general public--especially after the midnight hour. my kids don't have a set curfew, but i must hear from them before midnight if they're not going to be home by midnight. </p>
<p>both of my kids were so busy with sports and extra-curriculars that it wasn't much of an issue--they would be tired and would rarely make a decision to stay out too late on their own anyway!</p>
<p>We never had anything called a curfew at my house either. We always knew their plans, where they would be at all times, who they were with and talked about when they'd be home. If they were going to be ANY later than we agreed upon, they had to call. That said, rarely were they out later than midnight on a weekend but it depended on the activity. Like someone else said, my older D had to be up at 6:30 on weekends in winter for her sport so would never opt to stay out that late. But in any case, each situation or activity was discussed including when they'd be home by. Around here there is not much to do past midnight anyway. Also my kids did not go to parties where no parents would be present in the house. </p>
<p>Once my kids started driving (here it is age 16), they had to call as they arrived at their destination, call if they changed their location, call when they got to the next location and call before they were leaving to come home. They ALWAYS did. That was the only stipulation really, not a curfew. When we'd discuss when they'd be home, I had to agree with it but that itself was never a big issuse here. If they were going to be late at all, they were to call so I did not worry. Also, I always stayed up until they arrived. My younger D graduated high school at age 16 and had a license for five months during that time. About 2 1/2 of those months, she was not driving at all due to being severely injured in a car crash in which she was driving. Also before they could drive themselves, I surely was in control of the times because I was driving them all over the place! </p>
<p>Now that they are in college, sure they do what they want at school and do not have to account to anyone. When they come home, and are driving, they still have to tell me their plans, call me when they reach their destination, when they leave it to come home, and call if there is any change to that or if they are going to be late. There still is no strict curfew but again, we'd talk about the arrangements and I'd have to agree to it. I can't imagine them even now going out past 12:30 or so if here. I think beyond that, it would be a sleepover. My kids come home today in fact. They will be home very briefly anyway.</p>
<p>At my house, my older sister always had a curfew of, I think, 11 or 12. She had been caught drinking before, and loved to party. On the other hand, I don't have one. Legally, I'm not allowed to drive past midnight, so I'm home by then or just after. However, my parents always know basically where I am and what I'm doing. I don't drink all that much, and I don't have a good time when I'm high. My group of friends goes to the movies or to someone's house or out to dinner on Friday and Saturday nights. I call if we switch location, or if I'll be out past 11. I don't usually go out on weekdays except sometimes right after school for a couple of hours. </p>
<p>I think that your daughter should tell you what her plans are, and you should make the judgement on whether or not to let her go. If she's going to a restaurant to make her friend feel better, by all means let her go. If it's a sketchy party at some random person's house, maybe not.</p>
<p>No curfew here, either, A. Last year, he had a Midnight curfew on Fridays and Saturdays, and he was stellar about keeping it, with the exception of a few times when he was dating a girl who was in the cast of the Rocky Horror Picture Show... :eek:</p>
<p>Basically, we kept telling him that if he could stick to his Jr Yr curfew, we would loosen up on it considerably during his Senior Year, which is what we have done. Having gone through this once already with our D (who we decided is part vampire), we knew that he would be staying out, anyway. Curfew has evolved into more of a negotiation, i.e., What time do you think you'll be getting in? He gives us a general idea of what he'll be doing, and then gives us an estimated time. If he's later than that, he calls. </p>
<p>For example, last night. He went to a movie with friends. We got a call at 12:30 a.m. saying that he was spending the night at his best friend's house. The friend lives 30 minutes away, and it was too late to drive back. Who knows, he could be hanging upside down in a cave somewhere, but for the most part, he's trustworthy. ;)</p>
<p>I have an older son who is a freshman in college. He was never overly social, but by his senior year he had a group of friends and was out more.... </p>
<p>As the question is senior year, it probably is good to extend it some. Howver, I think, some limits both so they learn to respect others -you- and model reasonable behavior worked for us. </p>
<p>I would say we never had a strict curfew... especially senior year (btw I am the lenient parent) and as a senior the limits shoudl probably be extended --so to the OP your curfew of midnight weekends and 10 on school nights is probably a lost battle so I wouldnt fight it.. </p>
<p>I would point out parents have to go to work, kid to school ... in the house by 10pm doesnt seem unreasoanble --call it a target, I would allow a call and deferrment, but I woudl realize that you really have little punishment as a practical matter</p>
<p>Weekends are more of a problem...We say nothing good ever happens after midnight --but again as a practical matter I would suggest call if you are out past 1230 ... you should be home by 1...</p>
<p>I do think limits are still important .. we all know or hear of the 'good kid' injured or killed in an accident (isnt it usually late) ; arrested for drunk driving, arrested for manslaughter becasue they hit someone whiel driving drunk, drunk and pregnant, just pregnant , just tramatized by careless sex, being stupid at the IHOP at 1am... </p>
<p>Say what you want most of this happens late and if you can reduce their exposure good </p>
<p>Also to OP remember your daughter was at an unsupervised party at 130am 30 miles away ... I think trying to set some limits would be in order</p>
<p>My parents have negotiated my curfew with me on an escalating scale as I prove my responsibility. I had a couple problems with driving when I first got my license and they were concerned then, but I have been accident-free since then. After senior year began they became a little bit more lenient, especially in regards to Homecoming, parties, etc. Right now my curfew is usually 12:30 but sometimes I can negotiate it to 1 - the thing is, though, that usually I don't stay out as late as my curfew, but it's "nice to know" that I don't have to worry about getting home until them. I think a lot of kids can relate to that - they want the freedom, not necessarily to stay out to the brink of their curfew every night.</p>
<p>We don't have a strict curfew either, but the general guideline is that our daughter is not to be out past midnight if any driving is involved. She doesn't drive yet, but most of her friends do...but on provisional licenses which restrict driving past midnight. If she has a good reason for staying out past midnight AND I have agreed in advance to be the one to pick her up, there is some flexibility.</p>
<p>Our reasoning is the same as yours...although my daughter has a good track record and has never abused our trust, it's the "other guy" on the road we worry about. Although I don't think my daughter fully grasps or agrees with our concern, she does abide by it. There have been a few occasions where I've been leaving the house at midnight to pick her up, not getting home until after 1:00, but the sacrifice to my "beauty sleep" saves me from untold anxiety.</p>
<p>I think more important than a curfew is a rule that cell phone stays on and kid must take call from parents. </p>
<p>We were often critical of our neighbor's policy: No drinking and driving, with the implicit understanding that drinking without driving was ok. However, that policy has kept their kids safe. It can be very difficult (but critically important) for a teen to decline a ride because the driver may be impaired. If there are 2 or 3 passengers already in the car it takes a very mature strong-willed person to say "no".</p>
<p>For me, the issue was not so much about time (though honestly the very late night thing did not come up much) but more that I knew where they were at all times, with who, and approved of it, including who was driving, etc. They did not just "go out and come home at a certain time." </p>
<p>While you are right about accidents or bad things happening at late hours, just want to mention it can happen at any time. My D was in a very serious accident this past March at noon on a Sunday. She was leaving her dance studio, after teaching a dance she had choreographed for her tap troupe. Her studio is 25 miles from our house and she had just gotten on the highway, was distracted for a moment, was driving alone, and had a horrendous car crash. This, even after our strict limits. She wanted to travel to another city approx. 35 miles from the one she was at for dance and she was not allowed yet to drive to that city on her own as she had never yet done so and we were not ready for it yet until she had done it with us in the car. Due to our rules, she was just driving one exit to leave her car and to join friends who had had their license for over a year, can drive others, have driven to that city on their own many times (all this is checked first) and still had her accident less than a mile from her origin enroute to meet those friends who were to drive the rest of the way. Bad things happen at any time of day!</p>
<p>I've had the same house rules for years. The rules still apply with the kids now juniors in college.</p>
<p>1) where are you going?
2) when will you be home?
3) call if the answers change.
4) wake me up when you come home so I don't have to get out of bed to check that you're home safely.</p>
<p>My kids did very well with these rules.</p>
<p>However, you have two issues: one, irresponsibility (at a party that wasn't what you expected), and two, out late on school nights. It would be my inclination to sit very hard on this child until I had proof that she's behaving responsibly. </p>
<p>I can't believe how restrictive all of you seem to be. How do you expect your kids to act in college when they go from "in by midnight and make us aware of your every move" to "no authority, parties that start at 11 or later and go until 3-4 in the morning, and hanging out till the sun comes up many nights"? I've come and gone as I please with effectively no curfew since my sophomore year of high school (I have my own door to the outside and live in the basement), without any of the "check in"/"file your papers and tell us where your going" type rules and have done wonderfully this setup.</p>
<p>I will also say that most kids who want to be out late (i.e. not the kids who don't party/want to be home early) will be out regardless of curfew/etc - it is remarkably easy to sneak out (and I know from experience, I've snuck out at friends houses/helped people sneak out many times), it is even easier to concoct believable stories about what/where you will be (i.e. playing poker at a friends house when you are actually at a sketchy party), and to come up with good reasons to get curfew extensions when necesscary. Making ridiculous curfew rules, in my opinion, just makes it more likely that kids will abuse their freedom at college (i.e. staying out late, drinking too much, etc... just because they can, not because they enjoy it) while providing few to no benefits during high school.</p>
<p>No curfew here, either -- but also the cell phone rule: cell phone stays on, kid must take calls... or call in advance if she is going to be someplace where the phone must be turned off, like attending a concert. Also she needs to call at reasonable times to let me know of plans - generally around 6-ish if she isn't going to be home for dinner, and definitely by midnight if she is planning to be out later than that. But if she forgets, then I call her... as long as the phone is answered, no problem. </p>
<p>There rarely is an issue. D. is generally home at reasonable hours on school nights, generally out late on weekends, often spending the night at friends' houses (ok as long as she tells me where she is). </p>
<p>Our family dog is very, very good about letting me know exactly when a kid comes and goes. I am pretty good with dog language. So there's never been a need for any sort of reporting of arrival and departure times.</p>
<p>We have 11'oclock weeknight curfew, midnight weekend, with exceptions for advance notification. DS is a HS junior. College is a different story, but when darling children are in my house they need to follow house rules.</p>
<p>lucifer... i scanned your other posts, not a paragon of sensibility ..</p>
<p>with that a few random comments. some of curfews are for our benefit (i want to rest well at my advanced age so i dont want to worry about kids (aka roommates) ...2.. often parents know kids are sneaking and for many reasons let it go 3. hs kids are different than college 4. how do i expect my kids to act in college--at least legally ...let see more later </p>
<p>but to OP the lucifer comments are standard silly teenage drivel</p>
<p>I have to say, I think a set-in-stone midnight curfew is a little bit harsh. But I also don't know your daughter, and obviously the teenager makes a big difference. None of my friends had set curfews, and most of the time we wandered in around one- but most of the time, we weren't doing anything other than sitting at someone's house watching a movie, playing games, and talking. We weren't out ramming the roads, and all of us were constantly available by cell phone. </p>
<p>I'd be more concerned by the fact that she was 30 minutes away (and had to drive so far to get home) that late at night. There's a big difference between being 3 miles from home and being 25 miles from home. The most important part of all this is that your rules and your wife's rules are consistent. Giving her an extra hour will probably not change much in terms of her safety, and a one o'clock curfew will not kill her senior year social life. Or maybe the best way to go would be to set a curfew based on where she's going- for example, 12:00 if she's going to be far away or at a place you don't know very well, and 1:30 if she's going to be at a trusted friend's home right nearby. </p>
<p>I don't think you sound like a ridiculously controlling parent, regardless of what Lucifer says- and the vast majority of kids I know would not sneak out of their houses over a midnight curfew. It's just a matter of finding something that will not make her feel like she's missing out and will not make you feel like she's unsafe.</p>