Son is screwing up so badly at school I don't even know why I'm on this board!

Parents Forum Learning Differences and Challenges - LD, ADHD
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<p>My son is screwing up so badly at school that I don’t even know why I’m on this board…unless CC stands for Community College. DS has Asperger’s Syndrome and severe ADD. Here was his day yesterday:</p>

<li><p>I dropped him off at school early for a rehearsal that was actually supposed to be today.</p></li>
<li><p>Before the Pre-Calc test, the teacher took up the review sheets for a grade. He hadn’t understood that they were supposed to complete the review sheets…he had just filled in a few things to study from, so he got a 44 on the review sheet.</p></li>
<li><p>In English, they are starting to read “The Crucible” - 100 points if you brought the book in; he didn’t remember so that’s 100 points he doesn’t have.</p></li>
<li><p>He stayed after school for another rehearsal that everyone else knew had been cancelled.</p></li>
</ol>

<p>That’s DS’ life during the school year. I do wish that the teachers could see their classes/requirements through our eyes. So many of the things the kids get points/credit for have nothing to do with actually learning the subject matter. If you miss so many points for things like forgetting to bring a book to school, a child could truly fail a class while having total mastery of the subject matter.</p>

<p>Developmentally, he’s about at the level of a 7th grader. But he’s in AP classes, so the teachers are trying to give them the responsiblity of college students…that’s quite a gap!</p>

<p>Thanks for letting me vent.</p>

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<p>I understand your pain. But you need to be proactive as opposed to reactive. Does he have an IEP plan? If he does, did they take these things into consideration for him? If not, then maybe youas his advocate should do something about it. He is not capable of being his own advocate at the moment. With time, maturity, and training this will come. If you feel you cannot arrange these things he needs there are score of advocates who will do this for a fee. It is worth your money and sanity to check into this.</p>

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<p>He is walking without a net. He was dismissed from special ed services at the end of the freshman year because he didn't use what was offered. The special services are geared toward the low functioning student. He is taking 5 AP classes....NO ONE wants to give a kid any help when they are in AP classes. </p>

<p>We talk to each teacher about him before school starts. We will talk again on parents' night (Monday.) Some teachers go out of their way to be helpful, alterting us when there is a problem. Others are of the "there are no second chances" variety. He is very capable of learning the material in AP classes. But, of course, AP classes move quicker and require more personal responsiblity. When all is said and done, we want him to learn as much as he can in high school...I hope admissions officers will respect this. He could be the "star" in the "regular" classes that are populated with un-motivated students, but he wouldn't learn as much.</p>

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<p>Why is he in (5) AP classes? Is there something he likes about them besides the prestige? It does seem an unneccesary stress and doesn't garner much sympathy/support.</p>

<p>Edit; Just read the part about choice of classes; I think it is fortunate if kids with severe ADD get to be a star someplace.</p>

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<p>In many instances, the "next" class is an AP class. For example, last year he took Computer Programming and liked it; the next class in the sequence is an AP class. The next science class (unless he wanted to do Geology or Meteorology) is an AP class. Also, in many of the large public schools, the "regular" classes are where the kids who take drugs, get in fights, etc. exist. (He has always been in regular math; last year when a kid OD'd, it was in regular math that he learned the identies of the kids who sold the drugs, etc.)</p>

<p>His choir classes are "regular" classes and he has the same isssues there....not hearing the announcements, not signing in so he is counted absent, etc.</p>

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<p>Is he a senior? He sounds like my son ( although definately not Aspergers and I wouldn't call him severe). My son is a freshman and I'm just hoping he gets though high school without hating school...any more than he did in junior high. Or worse yet, drop out when he realizes some people do. Math has been his strength and I hope to gradually bring up the idea of honors with him...gulp...Fortunately he's at a small school. Good luck!</p>

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<p>He's a junior. He's a real sweetheart and actually likes school. He loves to learn new things. Every school year we have one or more "almost failing" scares. It's heartbreaking, because he can rattle off all the material, but then hasn't turned in a paper, or whatever. </p>

<p>At least he's done with his foreign language requirement. He has a friend whose Asperger's is more severe than his, and on days when that kid he had Spanish, he'd just go outside at the end of the day and literally scream from frustration.</p>

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<p>missypie: You have my sympathy. I am speaking as a mother with a S with ADD who did succeed. It is really frustrating. I am going to make some suggestions. Maybe one will address the issue. Please don't feel you need to respond. I know that most of my ideas won't work; however, any new idea is worth consideration. At least that's what I thougt going through this. </p>

<p>I assume with these diagnoses he is on medication. If not, he should be. If so, it's possible it's time to adjust the dosage. As they grow and mature sometimes higher doses of meds. are necessary. First day in Pre-cal. DS got a 70 on first test. Not usual for him. I immediately suspected in was meds. issue. Teacher insisted that the material was hard. After we saw practitioner and upped meds. He received a 99 on next test. Would teacher take this into account for quarter grade? No. Sigh. Oh well.</p>

<p>Five AP's is a lot. DS did it senior year and managed well, but he had built up his "sea legs." Freshman year: one, Soph. one. Junior: four. Senior: five. If he is a senior, perhaps it's appropriate for him. Otherwise, if he is really struggling (I understand that it's not with the academic content of courses) you need to be a little less perfectionistic with wanting him to learn as much as he can. This sounds like undue pressure.</p>

<p>Does he write everything down? I know this sounds obvious, but it was a big struggle to get DS to write things down.</p>

<p>Give him strong guidelines. If a worksheet is given, do it, do not regard it as a study sheet. That way, even if it does not need to handed in, it is completed and misunderstandings cannot result.</p>

<p>Does he have anyone he can call to verify work? This can be invaluable. </p>

<p>Most kids who have problems like ADD and Aspergers develop defense mechanisms that are as hurtful as the original condition such as anger, oppositional personality disorder, depression etc. I found that it was important to sort all this out and deal with these problems separately. I found that my S had a fair bit of overconfidence and a laissez-faire attitude that everything would always be alright. Dealing with these issues separately from the ADD was helpful because these attitudes were something he had control over, even if he didn't have control over the ADD.</p>

<p>Our outcome was that he is now at Williams with his medication. He seems to be doing well. I was a bit concerned, but we chose a very small environment for him so he would not get overwhelmed.</p>

<p>If none of my strategies had worked I would have considered a private or home school setting, even given the financial problems here, because meeting with a continual lack of success gets to be a habit.</p>

<p>Good luck!</p>

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<p>Thanks so much. Yes, he had 1 AP in 9th grade and 1 AP in 10th. This year was supposed to be 4, but when his schedule came out, he had one of his alternates instead....it was AP Psych. We kept it because Psych fascinates him.</p>

<p>Oh, yes, he is on meds. I think they are timed pretty well. In 8th grade, he was taking his pills right before school started, so they would last longer in the evening. He had Algebra 1st period. One day he came home saying that the teacher has a poster on the wall and that the pictures move and that he can't look away....time to take those pills earlier in the morning!</p>

<p>Yes, last night we told him that all worksheets must be completed. I guess we were being a bit more hands off this year, but we're finding that we can't back off as much as we thought.</p>

<p>Edited to add: I went back and looked at his four "problems" from yesterday. Three of the four were in his three non-AP classes.</p>

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<p>I know this is a "rant" and you are not looking for input but I must say this thread has been encouraging. While I never thought of my son as "severe" ( compared to the kids I treat; the best of those went to community college), in my house we get suspensions rather than "almost failing" scares. The academic stuff has been quickly remedied with increased surveilance ( school psots EVERYTHING on line; a Godsend!). Congratulations to your son for loving to learn and making it though some academic rigor. There is hope!</p>

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<p>It just kills me when intellectually gifted kids with serious LD's don't get the help they're entitled to from their schools. A student with Aspergers and ADD needs an IEP and support from the school -- support they would receive if only they were struggling academically; denying that help on the basis that the student is smart and talented academically makes no sense whatsoever. </p>

<p>I'm not sure what kinds of support and advocacy groups exist for gifted LD students in Texas, but I want to suggest that you try telephoning the National Dissemination (?) Center for Children with Disabilities at (800) 695-0285; they're also online at <a href="http://www.nichy.org%5B/url%5D"&gt;www.nichy.org&lt;/a>. If you explain that you need referrals and assistance with a gifted Aspergers/ADD high school student who is not receiving accommodation and assistance in AP classes in public school, the person at their switchboard will put you through to the right person there, and s/he will hopefully be able to give you local referrals. I think that many of the suggestions you've received here are helpful, but with the help of the school, and a GC or LD person there who would assist your son and maybe run interference with teachers, it would be a whole lot easier.</p>

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<p>missypie: I meant dosages, not timing, but perhaps that isn't the problem here.</p>

<p>Perhaps he gets more easily frustrated with others' lack of intelligence in the non-AP classes. If three out of the four problems were there, that's probably where secondary emotional issues are getting in the way.</p>

<p>Yes, it can be done. DS graduated kudos from all around and a scholarship from his school for being the "renaissance man" meaning that he had EC's from more different areas than anyone else in the school. Haha! A positive result from ADD -- can't focus and make up his mind what he wants to pursue so he just does everything.</p>

<p>I don't think the issue of the ADD will ever go away. H has it, and it still causes problems, but even in his case I think the secondary psychological symptoms are more destructive than the original ADD.</p>

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<p>Anonymom: Great advice. It's often the narrow-minded approach of teachers that causes the problem.</p>

<p>One anecdotal case: DS had forgotten to hand in assignment (sound familiar?) in AP Environmental. DS negotiated a one day grace. Teacher said it must be in by the end of the day. DS thought he could go home and email it to teacher because other teachers allowed this. Teacher assumed that S understood that he meant by end of school day and wouldn't budge even though son quite politely explained his position. This meant the difference between an 80 and a 90! There was no one in the school to intervene. </p>

<p>I knew S had been passive in his own advocacy so I drove him back to school to replead his case. Teacher knew all about ADD and still wouldn't budge. I told DS to offer to do extra credit. That, plus hearing I was waiting out in the car seemed to do the trick. (Teacher didn't yet have tenure in a very parent controlled school district.) Many of these situations recurred.</p>

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<p>"DS negotiated a one day grace.".... an 80....I would be thrilled! Especially if it was one more "lesson" about the benefit of attending to rules/details. Kudos to parents who can provide this kind of coaching. Any thoughts about how long you will do that?</p>

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<p>I just gave an incorrect email address for the DC group that offers excellent referrals for info, support, and advocacy. It is <a href="http://www.nichcy.org%5B/url%5D"&gt;www.nichcy.org&lt;/a> at (800) 695-0285.</p>

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<p>Here's a thought. In middle school, another kid we know wrote down everything he needed for the next day (with future projects he'd heard about that day) in his planner during class and passed it by the teacher at the end of class. If he couldn't get to the teacher for his check, he's email (basically at gunpoint, but still, he did it.) This worked, but the teachers have to be on board. This system wouldn't work for my kid, so we were on the telephone a really well organized girl plan.</p>

<p>I also wanted to say that despite the huge emphasis on taking absolutely the most challenging courses available -- especially if the kid is able to do the work and is interested -- this is not the path we chose. Given the nature of our kid's LD's, having time to assimilate the info and do the reading is a huge issue, especially given strong, time-consuming EC interests. It sounds as if at the OP's kid's school, non-AP courses may be intolerable; we were lucky that there were decent non-AP's available. And it is hard to get out of the mindset that if a class isn't absolutely stimulating and demanding, that somehow it will rot your kid's brain and doom his opportunity to enter the college of his choice. Still, when in idle conversation well-meaning people suggest that our son would undoubtedly be better served in AP this or that (He has several, just not all...) instead of what he's taking, we question our judgement again and again. But the pressures of a greatly increased workload, given the pressures of dealing with an LD with all its implications, seemed excessive to us.</p>

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<p>Lots of teachers/administrators have the belief that the law only requires them to give accomodations to help a student to pass a regular class....not to get an A or a B in an AP class. (A teacher friend of mine told me that her school was trying to remove special accomodations from a senior with a sp. ed diagnosis who was #2 in his class; the school knew that the other parents would freak out if he graduated with such a high rank "while receiving help.") Given the limited budgets that public schools have, it does make sense for them to put their resources in the areas of greatest need. But whether or not the law requires it, I think it is just smart to help every person to live up to his or her full potential.</p>

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<p>AnonyMom, we did the "teacher checking the planner" thing all through middle school. </p>

<p>The one thing we DON'T have to worry about with our son is getting the reading done. He is SCARY fast (he read the entire new Harry Potter book on a flight from Boston to Dallas.)</p>

<p>Actually, the teacher who scares me the most is PreCal, which is a regular class. On the materials that she sent home, she said she didn't accept late homework, or offer extra credit....your grade is your grade, no second chances.</p>

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<p>Man, I hope the teachers/administrators are wrong about the law. </p>

<p>How could it be that an Aspergers/ADD kid who was struggling in regular English could have an IEP and help with organization, a school-based LD liason to help the teacher understand the kid's needs, etc., whereas a kid with the identical diagnosis, and needing identical help with organization and liason with the teacher in AP English gets nothing? </p>

<p>I don't want to compare physical challenges with LD's, but this sort of interpretation of the law strikes me as making about as much sense as offering a sign translator to a deaf child who wasn't great at lip-reading in a remedial English class, but denying the child a sign translator in AP English.</p>

<p>Are there any legal types lurking here who could enlighten us?</p>

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<p>You think along the same lines as I do. No one would ever dream of telling a child in a wheelchair that the school doesn't need an elevator because all the regular classes are on the ground floor! </p>

<p>I actually used the sign language interpreter angle at his 8th grade ARD, when they were trying to wean him away from any help in high school because he won't have any help in the "real world." I asked if they took the sign language interpreters away from the deaf kids because they wouldn't have them in the real world. That bought us another year, but in all truthfulness, there was just no "help" they were willing to offer that was actually helpful. He doesn't NEED to go to a special study hall where the remedial math teacher can help him. What he needs is for the teacher to notice that he didn't turn his homework in and ask him for it.</p>