Stanford :Terrorism 101

Colleges and Universities A-Z Stanford University
81

<p>Here's what I see: a poster degrading on an inherently peaceful religion, basing his claim on a few choice opinions and mainstream media. The fact of the matter is we don't know how the majority of the people in the Middle East think or perceive the world-it is a different culture. I don't profess to know these things-I can only go off of my knowledge of the Quran (or Koran) and its ideologies. The fact that someone would selectively generalize a radical perversion of the religion to a millions and millions of people is admonishable. </p>

<p>Nobody is "stifling" anyone here-people are discouraging sweeping generalizations that possess little credence. Your comparison about Christianity is completely flawed because it is a "Western" religion. Its ideals are a big part of American society for many, so we are familiar with its aims and the general nature of its followers (I am Catholic as well). However, just as we cannot understand communism in the Far East, we cannot understand the Middle East. It is extremely difficult to even somewhat place oneself in the shoes, so to speak, of a Muslim person living in the Middle East. The vast majority of America lacks this perspective, and therefore, cannot accurately comment on it.</p>

<p>There is no "insider's knowledge." There is simply the fact that humility could go a long way when considering such matters. I understand that the current media stifles the positive aspects of Islam and its followers, especially post-9/11. The whole Muslim population has been unjustly polarized because of a fraction of its people. I don't judge people based on biases or the media. I don't judge people based on a current stereotype. It would be convenient of me to do so because it would justify this atrocious war, which seems to be a large motivator among Bush apologists (not saying the OP or anyone else is, though).</p>

<p>Again, discounting a perceived stereotype based on anecdotal evidence isn't stifling...it is being logical.</p>

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Your comparison about Christianity is completely flawed because it is a "Western" religion.

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<p>But what about the similar origins of the religions (Judaism)? All three are "Abrahamic" religions.</p>

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Its ideals are a big part of American society for many, so we are familiar with its aims and the general nature of its followers (I am Catholic as well).
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<p>I bet many non-christian Americans have a hard time understanding certain Christian ideas. </p>

<p>We must do our best to understand, be it Muslims in the Middle East or elsewhere. And the current media? Stifles positive aspects of Islam? Hmmm, not sure about that. And how do you know that "the vast majority of America lack perspective?"</p>

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<p>Because Christianity is the predominant religion in this country-it holds the most social and political clout (unfortunate, but true). Its origins are not as relevant because it has so many different sects and is so widespread, that it has become diluted. Capitalism has affected it, and been affected by it in return-Islam and Judaism differ in this respect.</p>

<p>Obviously many non-Christians will have a hard time understanding Christian ideas. This is true for any religion, which is really my point. However, Americans more readily have a perspective concerning Christianity because it is more familiar and prevalent in society and government.</p>

<p>How does the current medai NOT stifle positive aspects of Islam? Whenever you hear about it, it is about a suicide bomber or another al-Qaeda threat. Nobody cares to consider the actual ideologies of the religion, which are VERY similar to Christianity (Jesus is considered a great prophet and is mentioned).</p>

<p>And I know the vast majority of Americans lack perspective of Islam because it si a different culture. I hope you aren't going to attempt to refute that America is ignorant about other cultures (Far East, Africa, Middle East). This is a problem the media has only aggravated, but many people just aren't educated about it. Half the country voted for Bush (although for many reasons obviously), buying the farcical argument that countries like Iraq were plotting against us (while we, at the same time, are best buds with one of the worst in the region, Saudi Arabia). I mean, your average citizen probably doesn't have the time or interest in actually researching Islam and related topics. The mainstream media is the main source of information for people in this country, so it will be very difficult to get an objective source (w/ CNN and FOXNews and whatnot).</p>

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<p>
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How does the current medai NOT stifle positive aspects of Islam? Whenever you hear about it, it is about a suicide bomber or another al-Qaeda threat. Nobody cares to consider the actual ideologies of the religion, which are VERY similar to Christianity (Jesus is considered a great prophet and is mentioned).

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<p>If it bleeds, it leads. And guess what? No matter what anyone says to the contrary, most of the really noticeable terrorism is being committed by Muslims. What should the media report on, Muslims going to the store?</p>

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And I know the vast majority of Americans lack perspective of Islam because it si a different culture. I hope you aren't going to attempt to refute that America is ignorant about other cultures (Far East, Africa, Middle East).

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<p>Right, because this is a special, American-only trait. You want ignorant of other cultures? Come live in Japan, son.</p>

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This is a problem the media has only aggravated, but many people just aren't educated about it.

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<p>Hey, I read lots of articles in the NY Times and other papers that make a point of saying, "Not all Muslims are like this." I guess you just miss those. </p>

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Half the country voted for Bush (although for many reasons obviously), buying the farcical argument that countries like Iraq were plotting against us (while we, at the same time, are best buds with one of the worst in the region, Saudi Arabia).

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<p>Agreed. However, to be fair, I don't think most Americans voted for Bush the first time around because of Iraq (it wasn't even on the radar.) And in 2004, the most important factor was a large increase in per capita disposable income. But that's the political scientist in me talking, sorry.</p>

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mean, your average citizen probably doesn't have the time or interest in actually researching Islam and related topics.

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<p>No, and why should they? They're probably more concerned with their mortgage, kids, and maybe what's going on in their own country. Again, this is not America-specific. </p>

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The mainstream media is the main source of information for people in this country, so it will be very difficult to get an objective source (w/ CNN and FOXNews and whatnot).

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<p>And Al-Jazeera is an objective source? BBC is objective? Asahi Shimbun is objective?</p>

<p>Find me a 100% objective source, and I'll find a bridge to sell you.</p>

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<p>So, because most terrorism is being committed by Muslims, most Muslims are terrorists (or apologists)? I am not trying to sit here and tell you that radical Islam is not a problem (because it is). I am telling you that it's unfair to devout Muslims to jump to conclusions-I go by traditional ideologies when discussing a group that I am not intimately familiar with. It's not my job to prove Muslims are NOT terrorists overall-show me that they are, aside from the radical sects. I mean, these people are just that-people. They may have different cultures and values, but most of the people are simply in the crossfire, so to speak.</p>

<p>As far as the media, I'm just saying that nothing out there searches to even attempt to qualify reports-there is no alternative perspectives as far as Islam is concerned.</p>

<p>As for Bush, I was citing the '04 election.</p>

<p>Also, by agreeing that people are more concerned with their own specific issues (obviously) and lack the initiative to research independently, you are helping prove my point to the previous poster. Without knowledge and awareness, it's impossible to filter the news you watch. There is no 100% objective source, which is why people must be able to differentiate between fact and fiction, so to speak. If one has knowledge of Islam and its core principles, for example, one can watch any news station with a sort of BS meter. The key is finding many different sources and compositing them with hard fact-this will enable one to more efficiently and effectively form an opinion and understand the subject from multiple perspectives.</p>

<p>EDIT-I missed your blurb about the NYT. I have seen the articles you are referring to, actually-the problem is that the NYT is a liberal paper, and you don't commonly find articles like that in many places.</p>

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<p>I most certain agree that there is no objective source. Everytime i hear the word "objective" or "subjective" used by most people, I cringe and think, often telling them, that they're using it incorrectly. I agree with you two, that most people are more interested in their own lives.</p>

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So, because most terrorism is being committed by Muslims, most Muslims are terrorists (or apologists)?

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<p>When did I say that? But let's be honest, if you're reporting a terrorist attack somewhere in the world, odds are it was committed by a Muslim. What should the media do in this case? Not report a huge event? Lie about the perpetrator's identity?</p>

<p>That's how it goes. I wonder what percent of terrorist attacks in Northern Ireland were committed by Irish. How dare the media paint the Irish as terrorists!</p>

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It's not my job to prove Muslims are NOT terrorists overall-show me that they are, aside from the radical sects. I mean, these people are just that-people. They may have different cultures and values, but most of the people are simply in the crossfire, so to speak.

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<p>I don't think most people are arguing that that's the case. But we can recognize that there is a problem today in modern Islam with terrorism. </p>

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As far as the media, I'm just saying that nothing out there searches to even attempt to qualify reports-there is no alternative perspectives as far as Islam is concerned.

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<p>Well, there is Al-Jazeera in English, but that's like watching FOX News for the Arab world.</p>

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<p>You didn't say that (I was speaking in general). I am not arguing that terrorism in Islam is overstated-I am arguing that people all too readily associated the religion of Islam with terrorism. Terrorism is a significant problem in the religion, and it could definitely get worse, but right now it is the minority.</p>

<p>I am not saying the media should ignore terrorist attacks committed by Muslims (I never said this). These stories should be extensively covered; I was advocating a separate emphasis on the positive side of Islam whenever possible, so as not to breed an all-encompassing contempt of Islam. Terrorism can only be stopped by education. People in the Middle East should be exposed to the harsh reality of terrorism, dissuading young men who believe they have nothing to live for to join the cause. This seems to be the biggest problem-people in the region sometimes see no alternative (ie. their family was killed by a mortar, so they are easily recruited to help fight the offenders). By indirectly helping the region move forward, it will destroy the weapons the terrorist organizations wield. Also, by educating America and other countries about this reality, it will help in alleviating prejudices and encouraging a international collaborative effort to fix this problem.</p>

<p>Re. Al-Jazeera, not much can be said in support of it...</p>

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<p>Mystic,</p>

<p>In my experience, based on living in LA, SF, NY, and DC, most people are overwhelmingly unconcerned with their Muslim neighbors. As far as they're concerned, as long as they don't play music loudly, mow their damn lawns, and keep their dogs from crapping on the roses, it's not a concern.</p>

<p>But I think that the problem for the media is this: How to report Muslims in the proper light? You can't avoid the topic of terrorism, yet you can't sugarcoat it either. I think most of the mainstream media is not sure yet how to handle it, mostly because it's fairly new. And I think most recognize that Ann Coulter's vagina is the source of all evil in the world, so I'm not concerned about the far crazy right.</p>

<p>Then again, you also have the far crazy left who say that whatever Muslims do, because they're the underdogs, is okay. </p>

<p>But most mainstream media? Fairly even keeled as far as I can see.</p>

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<p>I think you and I agree on a lot of points.</p>

<p>I am not suggesting that IN America Muslims are oppressed more than any other minority group. I was really concentrating on the perception of Muslims in the Middle East.</p>

<p>I agree that it is difficult to report a terror attack in the proper intellectual light-so many variables are at play, that one cannot definitively encapsulate the event so neatly. Both extremist ends of the spectrum (right and left) are largely discounted by Americans, I agree.</p>

<p>As for mainstream media, it is balanced, as you say-you have your CNN, your BBC, your FOXNews and your Al-Jazeera. My problem with the mainstream media is the method in which they characterize and report terrorists and attacks (but, as I cited, this is a difficult topic to truly interpret and communicate).</p>

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<p>I think Muslims actually do pretty well in the States. But I have a very rosy experience set, full of urban cities to base my ideas on, so it might be a bit too optimistic. But, from what most of my Muslim friends say, it's not bad at all. A little tough to find the markets they like, but other than that pretty good.</p>

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<p>That's been my experience as well. Sure, there have been isolated incidents, especially after 9/11, but those things will happen, unfortunately. I do want to say that I appreciate your perspective on this issue, and I am glad we could find some common ground.</p>

<p>:)</p>

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<p>Kumbaya and all that. It's practically a love-in here.</p>

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<p>just read this thread...or peices of it</p>

<p>n going back a few pages, to the whole debate about religious fundamentalism, i would think it very highly unqualified to associate the religion of Islam with political regimes in the middle east that claim to be "islamic states" or hold "islamic values" Not a single person alive today has seen a real islamic state, simply because it does not exist. When it did, around 700-1200 AD, it flourished in its own right. As a matter of fact, you can ask any professor in Islamic Studies or History of the Middle East, but the Islamic Caliphate (Khilafa) was the closet thing to a utopian society the world had ever seen. A great achievement would be that fact that they achieved 0% poverty, and not only that, but they had 0% Divorce (not becasue women cannot divorce, which they are entitled to, and if you study theology Islam most definatly brings more rights to women than any other train of thought, whether people follow them now is a different matter), also 0% Drugs, 100% Literacy, 0% Crime, 0% Murder, and also 0% Alcohol, which I'm sure prevented alot of problems. Now my point is, you really can't judge Islam from politics NOR from followers, if you would actully take time to look at the religion in its true sense, many people would be utterly shocked, and that seems to be the only positive outcome from all this attention the muslim world has right now, that Islam is growing rapidly, just look at the number of American converts after 9/11. </p>

<p>And in response to the current topic at hand, I would slightly disagree. I don't want to drag on, but just like the world was once British or Not, or Communist or Capitalist...now it seems that it is Muslim vs. Non.</p>

<p>just my 2 cents</p>

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<p>I'd be ****ed off if they blew up Disneyland...
What do I do with the remainder of my year-round pass?</p>

<p>Pretty hilarious:)</p>

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<p>hahaha funny stuff....i like the reference to the Electric Six song, "Gaybar." Google it X-D</p>