<p>fromthesouth ...your post illustrates more than you know. Re: intellect, I'd like to think you are tongue-in-cheek. But somehow I doubt it.</p>
<p>Sorry you've been ex-communicated. That hurts. Still, I'm confident there are plenty of folks praying for and loving you, no matter your lostness. Yours is the creator of some of the most broken of hearts, aching for you.</p>
<p>I spoke only from personal experience, not to single out Christianity. I wasn't going to talk about it, but then I read Durak1234's post and it was exactly the stuff people used to tell me when they found out I wasn't Christian. For all I know Durak could be one of those people.</p>
<p>Also, I have never discriminated against Christians and do not expect discrimination against me. Nor have I ever encountered that sort of discrimination against Christians, and I assure you I've travelled a lot. I've never seen anyone asked to refrain from praying in a public restaurant. Even in my country, where Christians are a minority, we respect other people's beliefs, even if we might not agree with them.
So when I'm in a country where Christians are in majority, I'd expect that same sort of respect in return. I don't expect you to convert and follow my religion, but the least you can do is not discriminate against me and then justify it by stating a laundry list of atrocities you have had to face.</p>
<p>blue,</p>
<p>Unless you are on the receiving end, it is often difficult to see discrimination as it is occurring. As U.S. Christians, we see our ideals and beliefs being railroaded almost daily, all in the name of tolerance. I have personally been told to leave my Bible in my home, tuck in my dainty cross necklace, and turn my Christian shirt inside-out. I have been stared at, glared at and heard the quiet whisperings of people disgusted because I chose to quiety bow my head and pray over my food while dining in a public restaurant. That's not to say that all non-believers behave in these manners...just as it isn't fair to say that all Christians force their believes on others or discriminate against those who don't believe in Christ. </p>
<p>Are some Christians forceful? Absolutely...but again, that doesn't mean that all Christians are, and it doesn't mean that the Christian faith calls for its followers to be forceful. Some Germans were horrible, horrible people....but that doesn't make every German a horrible person, right?</p>
<p>That's true. It's unfair to generalize. I'm sorry I flared up a bit. Bad memories.</p>
<p>Not a problem, blue...we all have times when we need to vent our frustrations.</p>
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<p>Take the high road. If you are spiritually enlightened, good for you. For those that bash your religion and beliefs, don't you think it just makes your faith stronger?
</p>
<p>I like your style. Let the religious have their fun. Careful with those words though; spiritual enlightenment is quite different from (blind) faith. Also, polar positive feedback loops are bad news bears. We wouldn't want an all-out war between nonbelievers and believers now would we?</p>
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<p>Allow me to make you aware. I'm sure you have pre-prepared rationalizations at your ready so let me say them for you. "Blah Blah it's not that the BIBLE has ever been wrong but rather people's INTERPRETATIONS of the bible that have been wrong Bleh Bleh"</p>
<p>Behold! Isaiah 30:26:</p>
<p>"The light of the moon shall be as the light of the sun, and the light of the sun shall be sevenfold."</p>
<p>I'll give it to you that the light of the moon is technically derived from the light of the sun. HOWEVER, the perceived luminosity of the moon is nowhere near 1/7 of that of the sun. 7 full moons do not equal one sun. I'm sure that given your 'all-or-nothing' approached to the bible you can appreciate my attention to detail. </p>
<p>The bible is cool and all, but please give humanity more credit than that.</p>
<p>Narc,</p>
<p>It might be more helpful if you actually studied the verse you quoted. Some Biblical passages are prophetic and haven't occurred yet. Others are figurative. For example, one passage states that Jesus is the vine and believers are the branches...last time I looked in the mirror, I didn't resemble a tree or a branch on a tree. That doesn't mean that the Biblical isn't truthful and it doesn't mean that anyoen expects humanity to be dumb. One cannot take a single verse or small portion of a passage and use it to state an error or a belief...it has to be taken in context, with a deeper understanding of the times and verbage used. You might find it interesting to note that the word moon, in its original language and text (Strong's Hebrew definition #03835) can actually mean to make white, become white, purify. The word light (Strong's Hebrew definition #0216)can mean light of instruction or light of prosperity. </p>
<p>So just taking the words at their face value isn't always enough...one has to look at everything that was said in the entire passage and the context of the passage to determine the true Biblical meaning.</p>
<p>Why does god like slavery?</p>
<p>Sorry, but you say they are praying for my "lostness"? Why must I be lost because I don't believe in fairy tales?</p>
<p>Fromthesouth,</p>
<p>Christians believe that those who don't believe are lost, because the Bible says so. We pray for those who don't believe, that some day they will come to know the truth and accept Christ as Lord and Savior because we do not want to see anyone perish. Quite honestly,, does it hurt anything for someone to pray for your soul? Just because you believe that Christianity is nothing more than a fairy tale, it doesn't mean you are correct. For discussion sake: What if you are wrong? What if everything in the Bible is the truth? Wouldn't you be glad to find out that people cared enough about you to offer up prayers on your behalf? Wouldn't you be angry if you stood in front of Jesus and found out that no one you knew who did believe in Him had bothered to pray for your salvation? </p>
<p>And if we're wrong...what are we hurting by praying for others? Who do we hurt when we pray for our loved ones or friends recovery from an ailment or the salvation of their soul? Are we really harming anyone?</p>
<p>And on the note of your concept that Christianity is a fairy tale...take it from someone who knows...Christianity is anything but a fairy tale. Life isn't happy ever after for Christians...we face the same trying times as those who do not believe. We get sick, have heartaches, feel pain, disappointment and dispair. We are dispised and hated, just for believeing in the name of Jesus Christ. We are hunted and killed, tortured and jailed. Discriminated against and forced to move into the shadows of every day society. (Some societies are not as harsh as others...but there are areas of the world where the simple ownership of a Bible that never leaves your home can land you in prison for the rest of your life or set you in front of a firing squad.) The difference is that we believe that everything happens for a specific reason and will always glorify our Lord. We find peace during the most troublesome of times through the knowledge that our Lord is in complete control over everything that happens in the world. We live by the motto "One day at a time". So where is the harm??</p>
<p>Tboone,</p>
<p>God doesn't like slavery and I am not sure where you got the idea that he did. Have Christians owned slaves? I'm pretty sure they have. Christians have also committed murder, rape, adultery, etc. Honest and true Christian believers will never proclaim to be perfect beings...we are just as far from perfect as those who do not believe. We can make the same mistakes as those who do not believe. There are also those who claim to be Christian but really aren't. Take Hitler, for example. He led the Holocaust under the guise of Christianity but his actions were not acceptable to God. His behavior and cold-blooded murder of others were not Christian. Quite honestly, I don't consider Hilter a Christian. Just because someone takes the label of Christian, it doesn't mean they are. Just because a Christian does something, it doesn't mean that the action is allowable by God.</p>
<p>I haven't been reading the past posts because I'm too lazy, but I'll just state my opinion. I don't think this sub-section is a bad idea at all. There are MANY Christian colleges out there, and there are a lot of people looking for a Christian education. If there is a demand for a place to discuss Christian colleges, then let there be one. </p>
<p>With that said, if there is high demand for some other specialty of colleges, then I don't see why there can not be another sub-section for that.</p>
<p>but the bible doesnt condemn slavery, actually both the OT and the NT endorse it in a literal sense. It talks in detail about regulating slavery, and the conditions under which a master can and cannot kill his slaves, and what he can do for them.</p>
<p>Tboone, again, you haven't done your homework. Except for non-Jewish slaveholders (especially the Egyptians), slaves of Biblical days were not treated as we commonly believe. In Biblical times, the terminology would better be compared to indentured serventude than actual slavery. Another analogy would be today's military personnel. They are a form of slave, unable to quit their military assignment at will, forced to follow rules they may not agree with or pay a stiff penalty if they don't. One also has to dismiss their preconceived notion of egalitarian morality. And men are not guaranteed equal opportunity in the Bible....just look at the requirements for getting into Heaven...Narrow is the road that leads to righteous and few will make it to Heaven.</p>
<p>Do some research on slavery during the OT and NT times..research Biblical passages, in their original texts and languages. Explore how society actually was during Biblical times. Then maybe you will have a better understanding of the issues surrounding those Biblical citations you mention.</p>
<p>whoa whoa whoa whoa whoa!!!!!!!!!</p>
<p>what you are saying is blaspheme. </p>
<p>You actually think that you have to interpret the bible? I thought the bible was the inspired word of god. ***. What are you going to tell me now, that homosexuality is not condemned in the bible too? Blaspheme! Seriously, what do you think about homosexuality in the bible!</p>
<p>
[quote]
Narc,</p>
<p>It might be more helpful if you actually studied the verse you quoted. Some Biblical passages are prophetic and haven't occurred yet. Others are figurative. For example, one passage states that Jesus is the vine and believers are the branches...last time I looked in the mirror, I didn't resemble a tree or a branch on a tree. That doesn't mean that the Biblical isn't truthful and it doesn't mean that anyoen expects humanity to be dumb. One cannot take a single verse or small portion of a passage and use it to state an error or a belief...it has to be taken in context, with a deeper understanding of the times and verbage used. You might find it interesting to note that the word moon, in its original language and text (Strong's Hebrew definition #03835) can actually mean to make white, become white, purify. The word light (Strong's Hebrew definition #0216)can mean light of instruction or light of prosperity.</p>
<p>So just taking the words at their face value isn't always enough...one has to look at everything that was said in the entire passage and the context of the passage to determine the true Biblical meaning.
[/quote]
</p>
<p>So let me get this straight...you know, just to make sure I understand this correctly. Any parts of the Bible which happen to coincide with modern scientific discoveries clearly prove the truth of what's written in the Bible, while the (many more) parts of the Bible that are clearly ridiculous in light of the knowledge humanity has gleaned in the past few centuries are obviously just metaphors that are meant to be taken figuratively and don't prove anything?</p>
<p>That's very convenient...and also non-falsifiable.</p>
<p>
[quote]
originally posted by NikkiiL</p>
<p>Based on my biblical studies which included reviewing Genesis (as part of my college degree), the Hebrew text for the Creation story doesn't lead one to believe it is merely a legend. As with other portions of the Bible, the physical authors (those who put the words onto "paper") were not physically there to witness the events but had either reliable witnesses or were told directly by God what to write. Sciences "explanations" of old-aged earth is just Satan's way of confusing mankind. If God says He created everything in 6 days...then He created everything in 6 days, not 6 billion years by allowing man to evolve from amoeba to animal to human being.
[/quote]
</p>
<p>Wait, but judging by your own logic, slave=slave, not indentured servant. God wrote the word slave in the bible, not the word indentured servant. I actually think we have a biblical mandate to still hold slaves. You clearly cannot be one of those blasphemous weirdo's who believes in a "living" bible that one must constantly reinterpret based on the evolution of human understanding of the world in which we live, and society itself. I mean common, you cannot have it both ways.</p>
<p>Ugh... this thread was a bad idea.</p>
<p>I am not talking about interpretation but having an understanding of the times the Bible was written in and the language used. We cannot take the English language and today's society method of using those words and even begin to think that our meaning is the exact same as the meaning during Biblical times.</p>
<p>Same thing applies to other cultures of today....if I asked you for a rubber, what would you think I meant by that? Are you sure??</p>
<p>
[quote]
Originally Posted by Tboonepickens:
I subscribe to the doctrine that believes that evolution was "presided" over by god but that it did in fact happen. I think taking genesis as a literal book seems somewhat foolish because it was written to describe the world to a bunch of cavemen jews about 3,000 years ago
[/quote]
</p>
<p>
[quote]
Originally posted by NikkiiL:</p>
<p>Tboone,</p>
<p>If we take Genesis as anything but an actual account of what occurred, then we must take the rest of the Bible in the same light...which weakens the Christian faith entirely. If Genesis isn't literal, then neither is the birth of Jesus Christ,
[/quote]
</p>
<p>
[quote]
originally posted by NikkiiL:</p>
<p>I have always had a hard time understanding how people can say that nothing in the Bible is to be taken literally or that by holding to a literal interpretation of the Bible is imposisble as it wouldn't pertain to our time period.
[/quote]
</p>
<p>You state in your own posts, the bible is literal. They talk about slaves in multiple areas of the bible, NT and OT. They say that a man cannot kill his slaves. They give some basic rules about keeping slaves. Jesus says that a good christian slave is an obedient christian slave. Going by your interpretation that everything in the bible is literal, I think it endorses slavery.</p>