<p>For those telling me no one wants to hear the stuff I'm saying, you are the ones out of tune. Here is an article about a debate on this topic with law school faculty at 2 lesser known schools you might have heard of.....UCLA and Stanford.</p>
<p>Law</a> profs. debate affirmative action - The Stanford Daily Online</p>
<p>All I see in this thread is someone that crying because he didn't get in UF.. LOL.. UF is a good school, but it isn't everything.. You didn't get accepted.. move on and find a college that fits your needs.. I bet you will do great in any college you go to</p>
<p>???? huh?</p>
<p>First I would just like to say this seems to have been an interesting debate so far. Bascially the future of the University of Florida hangs in the balance. Which ever way it goes I still believe the future of UF is bright!</p>
<p>Option 1 - On one side we have a group of people who believe that by having UF become more diverse it will in fact bring the institution up. Their is a buzz going on around the country that is talking about how UF is committed to diversity, and that we need to mirror the population of the state of Florida. The New York Times did an article discussing how UF is commited to improving Social Justice.</p>
<p>Option 2 - On the other side we have an alumni (MBA from UF) who is advocating to be color-blind in our admissions policies. He is of the opinion that only the best & brightest should be admitted (he believes SAT, ACT, and GPA are the benchmarks for this classification), and that anything short of this policy will be unfair to the most qualified applicant. He referenced the University of Chicago's admissions policies as that which UF should endeavor to emulate.</p>
<p>Okay let me just say this: I side with those who seek diversity, and I believe Social Justice is very important to UF. The state of Florida is changing in demographics. We went from 15.3 million residents in 2000 to now 18.5 million residents in 2008. The influx has been primarily Hispanic Residents, and a 5% increase in Midwestern transplants.</p>
<p>I do however believe Tomlansky is providing a very solid analysis. He clearly is an expert at analzing the statistics that have been provided. Don't label him as a bigot or racist.</p>
<p>Perhaps there can be an Option 3. We need to always endeavor to promote diversity, however UF should not be so radical in this pursuit. From 1998 - 2006 UF has raised minority enrollment by over 6%. Perhaps we should slow it down just a little bit, and have a more Progressive reform package. This way everyone feels more comfortable with the progress UF is making. </p>
<p>In essence, I believe a compromise must be made...</p>
<p>first, there are many oboe players at UF...the school of music has different opportunities for each instrument to study with the professor of that instrument, and its called a studio. second, my whole problem i had with the AIM program was that those people were getting money for free and there was no real reason for it, over people who were not placed in the program. Get your facts straight. I never said these people didnt deserve to be at UF, its just that I dont see why they get free money.</p>
<p>Second, I dont care how much tomslawsky analyzes statistics and how much strong of an argument he THINKS he has. His analogy completely revealed his view on UF, which is the fact that he thinks UF only considers someone qualified based off one characteristic, which is SATs (or lifting a certain amount of weights in his analogy). However, what he fails to realize is that UF considers people qualified in many other ways other than SATs, and its apparently NOT making the school look dumber based off of the "solid" evidence I provided about the rankings of hispanics and african americans receiving bachelors, professional, and PhD degrees. Once an applicant is considered QUALIFIED, it really doesnt matter what you feel because UF has made it clear that they cant take every qualified applicant. Get over it, and I think you were rejected by UF, I do not believe you are any alumni. </p>
<p>and if you are an alumni, why dont you go use your degree to become an admissions officer at UF and change UF history.....</p>
<p>
[quote]
oboe players at UF...the school of music has different opportunities for each instrument to study with the professor of that instrument, and its called a studio.
[/quote]
</p>
<p>I hear Dr. Odom is great to work with.</p>
<p>she's awesome!</p>
<p>Oboesmrtguy40, you should read the posts more carefully before spouting off. It was I who made up the analogy on lifting weights, NOT tomslawsky. And re that analogy, it was only about a 30-second effort, but a decent one nonetheless ( I could have added something on GPA, but thought it would be obvious where I was heading). But I can see I struck a cord by mentioning SAT, which now causes me to wonder that perhaps you didn't score a 1420 after all.</p>
<p>I do believe that standardized test scores combined with GPA are the best predictor of success in college. College is an academic endeavor. It's not a trade school. Certainly other traits reflect talent and enhance a person's overall potential. However, they are third best at most. UF, however, has adopted a so-called holistic approach to admissions in which they have elevated the importance of tertiary characteristics to primary and secondary importance. Therein lies the problem. It's obvious that this approach is racially-motivated. (FYI, there's much on the web about ULCA's efforts in this regard, for those who are interested.) It's good to help under-privileged people, but NOT when it substantially harms others.</p>
<p>For a moment or two I thought you might actually be capable of thoughtful debate, but then it occurred to me that you just want to beat the affirmative action drum as loudly as possible and try to belittle and chase off anyone who disagrees with you. You appear to have to no real interest in analyzing and discussing the underlying issues of any of the arguments debated here.</p>
<p>i definitely scored a 1420. I am in hume as we speak writing this. you can continue with the bull, i'm over it. i refuse to conform to your beliefs, you minority blocking loser
;)</p>
<p>and for the record i am not a supporter of affirmative action. i just feel that people can have different qualifications. for a second i actually thought you had half the brain to understand this.</p>
<p>you people are a disgrace</p>
<p>So I can see this debate has ended in hurt feelings. No harm was intended. We all come from different backgrounds, which predisposes us to certain beliefs, some of which we have long held as inviolate. Some of these are good and true and some just ain’t so.</p>
<p>Whether it's real or perceived, the key word here is condescension, both on the giving and receiving ends.</p>
<p>OBOE- you can't logically argue. Period. When I make a point that is seeded in logic, you ether divert the subject or attack me. It is an effective way of arguing, but not a valid way to win on logic. </p>
<p>What "proof" have you brought to the table? UF grants more degrees to AA than most schools. OK, If you want to analyze this, lets
*What is the attrition ratio of AA's entering UF
* What percentage of those entering under "holistic admissions" admissions graduate
*What is the ratio of AA admitted under holistic admissions that graduate to the ratio of the University as a whole
*What is the graduation percentage of AA's admitted under holistic admissions compared to those applicants Dinged (that wind up at other colleges) to make room for them that wound up at other schools.</p>
<p>Unless you can provide parity for the stats above, you've brought no proof. </p>
<p>Now, try, just TRY please to post and show where/how I'm wrong without an ad homonym attack.</p>
<p>Internet,serious business.</p>
<p>SSOBICK, FLBOY-
thank you both for being logical in here. SSOBICK, you presented an articulate, logical argument and if we were on the same admissions committee, you would have my ear about how to compromise. May not happen, but you've got me willing to listen, analyze and be open minded. Maybe because you don't sound bitter :)</p>
<p>By the way, I don't graduate till December....get another Football Season-and unlike OBOE, I want the gators to kick ass....go gators!</p>
<p>Or...maybe try for next semester for Noter Dame, Boston College?</p>
<p>posted this and above on wrong topic...sorry</p>
<p>Looking at obo's post history, I really question his credibility. Seeing as he's put inconsistent info about himself in much of the threads he posts on, I suggest EVERYONE take with a grain of salt whatever he says.</p>
<p>the post history i have of last year and stuff about UF admissions was a way to ask about my friends and their chances because they dont have accounts, and its just easier. my credibility is true and i have nothing to prove to you people.</p>
<p>and i can very well argue, you just dont accept it.</p>