Wouldn't it be great?

Applying to College
1

<p>If one year, all the high school seniors stood up to the commercialized college admissions process and said that they were fed up with it and wouldn't take it any longer?!</p>

<p>Wouldn't it be great?</p>

<p>If one year, high school students decided that they would truly follow their passions, not some preconceived "college approved" passion to gain entrance to the hallowed gates.</p>

<p>Wouldn't it be great? </p>

<p>If one year, high school students decided to forego being labeled as a number, and did not take PSAT's, SAT's, SAT II's, AP's, ACT's.......after all, how many colleges say that they look past the scores to see "the real applicant"...yeah, right! "The real applicant" is something that cannot be measured by numbers to be listed in the US News College rankings, so most colleges really could care less.</p>

<p>Wouldn't it be great?</p>

<p>If one year, high school students decided to be just that...high school students...and enjoy high school...instead of analyzing the appearance of everything in terms of college admissions.</p>

<p>Wouldn't it be great? </p>

<p>If one year, the admissions offices at the Swarthmores and the Middleburys and the UCs and the Browns of this world only received a trickle of applications instead of the deluge that has become the norm. And if these colleges had to rethink their process of impressing and attracting students, instead of the student carrying the burden of impressing and attracting the college? </p>

<p>Wouldn’t it be great?</p>

<p>If one year, high school seniors decided to simply opt out of the game. If they decided to spend their second semester looking into travel options or volunteer options or community college classes or jobs to earn college money, and put off the process for a year. If high school seniors discovered that the colleges that rejected you are no more a reflection of your self worth than the colleges that accepted you. If high school seniors just said, “enough”.</p>

<p>Wouldn’t it be great?</p>

2

<p>meh.........no</p>

3

<p>No. It would be horrible.</p>

4

<p>Is your favorite book Peter Pan?</p>

5

<p>Only 15.5% of Americans finish college...so no, it would not be great.</p>

6

<p>Have you read the comments from rejected/waitlisted kids the past few days? They are doubting the direction and meaning of their lives, some to the point of discussing suicide. You find this "okay"?</p>

<p>I am not saying that kids should not go to college. I am almost halfway through already at a top tier LAC, so am not writing from sour grapes. I simply think the entire process has gotten out of hand and it is time that things change. Read the mission of the Education Conservancy. THIS is what I am talking about...</p>

<p>And.....don't knock Peter Pan! :)</p>

7

<p>While I think that people can take this far too seriously, no, I don't think it would be great. I'm a very competitive person and I enjoy taking part in difficult classes, becoming very involved in school activities. It's not about getting into college, it's about becoming the best person you can be. I never studied for the SAT or ACT or whatever, because I feel that they should measure your work during high school - your natural ability. People do what you suggested all the time. However, if they don't want to pursue that prize, they shouldn't complain when they don't get it. To the people who pursue it and then find out that they weren't what the ad comm was looking for that day, forget it! They've still bettered themselves and will find that with that continued initiative, they will be succesful at whatever school they go to.</p>

8

<p>Wouldn't it be great? </p>

<hr>

<p>
[quote]
If one year, all the high school seniors stood up to the commercialized college admissions process and said that they were fed up with it and wouldn't take it any longer?!

[/quote]
not sure what this one means </p>

<p>
[quote]
If one year, high school students decided that they would truly follow their passions, not some preconceived "college approved" passion to gain entrance to the hallowed gates.

[/quote]
umm ... NOONE is forcing kids to do things to look good for colleges ... lots of kids manage to do fine with college admission and their life while using HS as a time to grow as opposed to a time to build their college credentials ... it really is your choice.</p>

<p>
[quote]
If one year, high school students decided to forego being labeled as a number, and did not take PSAT's, SAT's, SAT II's, AP's, ACT's.......after all, how many colleges say that they look past the scores to see "the real applicant"...yeah, right! "The real applicant" is something that cannot be measured by numbers to be listed in the US News College rankings, so most colleges really could care less.

[/quote]
Your choice also ... but if you're shooting for top schools how do you propose they differentiate records from thousands of high schools? There are schools who do not use standardized tests ... apply to those ... it is your choice and it is available.</p>

<p>
[quote]
If one year, high school students decided to be just that...high school students...and enjoy high school...instead of analyzing the appearance of everything in terms of college admissions.

[/quote]
See answer above ... this is your choice and is a choice available now</p>

<p>
[quote]
If one year, the admissions offices at the Swarthmores and the Middleburys and the UCs and the Browns of this world only received a trickle of applications instead of the deluge that has become the norm. And if these colleges had to rethink their process of impressing and attracting students, instead of the student carrying the burden of impressing and attracting the college?

[/quote]
not sure where to go with this one ... colleges do try to impress and atrack; which is part of what leads to tons of applicants so to me you're asking for both sides of the equation. And again it is your choice if you try to impress and attrack schools beyond a well written application outlining the life you have lived (while not planning activities while worrying about how it will look to colleges)</p>

<p>
[quote]
If one year, high school seniors decided to simply opt out of the game. If they decided to spend their second semester looking into travel options or volunteer options or community college classes or jobs to earn college money, and put off the process for a year. If high school seniors discovered that the colleges that rejected you are no more a reflection of your self worth than the colleges that accepted you. If high school seniors just said, “enough”.

[/quote]
And why is this not possible now?</p>

<p>I am not trying to be flippant ... but for me one of lives lessons was to ignore what conventional wisdom said I should do and figure out what I wanted to do ... and the funny thing was when I focused on my growth and needs my options then expanded. The best way to get into a top tier school is to not focus on getting into a top tier school but on keeping busy doing stuff you love to do (including school work).</p>

<p>Strange analogy ... but listen to a player who choked free throws at the end of a basketball game and they almost always talk about how they knew they needed to make the free throws (focusing on the outcome) while listening to clutch players they almost never focus on the outcome but talk about the process (I've practiced free throws a million times ... I knoew if I stayed calm and shot them like at practice things would be fine). Are you focused on getting a top tier admission or is a top tier admission the natural progression of the life you've been living because your life journey is taking you there?</p>

9

<p>Divanny,
You are totally right!!!</p>

<p>It IS supposed to be about being the best person you can be, about learning for learning's sake, about being passionate about your interests. But I REALLY think you (and I) are in the minority. </p>

<p>I never studied for the SAT's either, and did fine on them. Not perfect, but fine. I LOVED high school, and challenged myself, just as you did. I have fantastic memories of high school. </p>

<p>But too many kids are starting to define themselves by their SAT scores or the acceptances (and denials) that start rolling in this time of year. I find this really sad, and wish that college admissions would change. The system needs to be overhauled.</p>

<p>As far as the 15% of Americans that graduate from college.....not everyone is meant to go to college.....my own parents being 2 of them. They are very successful in their lives without the honor of a college degree. Happy, successful people! I do feel that the 15% of Americans that graduate from college is a sign, though, that something is wrong with the system.</p>

10

<p>Hey everyone,
If you guys are happy with the current system....fair enough. Hope all went well with your admissions process, and that you will be really happy next year.</p>

<p>I am simply saying that I feel that the system is becoming over-commercialized. The former undergraduate admissions dean at UC Berkeley says it much better than I could:</p>

<p>"yank back the college application/admission process from the grasp of college rankings, commercial guidebooks, and expensive private consultants and to restore it where it belongs: in the hands of students and their parents. "</p>

<p>Again....if you are happy with the current system, I have no bones to pick with you. I do feel that alot of people aren't happy with the system, though.</p>

11

<p>people with low sats and grades who want to get into good schools for doing nothing perhaps.</p>

12

<p>"people with low sats and grades who want to get into good schools for doing nothing perhaps"</p>

<p>Okay, you obvioulsy have no clue about what I am talking about here...I give up....maybe ask andison about what happened to him a year ago to enlighten you.....</p>

<p>back to class :) and thank god the process is 2 years behind me. Good luck to everyone!</p>

13

<p>Of course it sounds nice, but what is the alternative for determining is someone is fit for a certain college? Extensive and multiple interviews, psychological profiles, teacher recommendations and essays?</p>

14

<p>I am unhappy with the system. In so many ways. From outrageous financial aid offers (if you get into an elite school having a low EFC is great...not so for me) to waitlist with way more canidates on them than the college knows they could ever admit (waitlists should be for a select number where there's a good chance, 50-50, that you'll actually get off).</p>

15

<p>The process is stressful, sure, but those kids you mentioned have problems totally independent of the college admissions process. The process isn't fair, but it should've serve as a strawman scapegoat either.</p>

16

<p>Yes celebrian, I agree! I am the past recipient of 5 waitlist letters! Never got off any of them, but luckily was accepted to a great LAC. I have been very happy at college, but once you go through the process, you never really feel the same way about it again. You really feel as though it is a false, superficial process. </p>

<p>I mentioned the Educational Conservancy once before. It was recently introduced to me by a guidance counselor at my old high school. It's values are being embraced by more and more admissions professionals, both high school and college. Let's hope that it brings some sanity back to the process. </p>

<p>From the website:</p>

<p>"Goals
To increase the awareness and understanding of commercial influences in college admissions.
To provide a platform for educational values to assert their proper role in college admissions.
To promote educationally appropriate admission practices.
To make college admissions a sensible and productive set of processes for all.
To foster collaborative behavior among colleges.
To generate specific admissions-related ideas and recommendations for colleges, students, and counselors. top of page</p>

<p>Services</p>

<p>Consulting with schools regarding the development of effective college counseling programs and materials.
Public speaking -- at conferences and to groups of students and parents. (more info-pdf)
Providing resources to counselors, students, parents and colleges.
Generating data that support educationally responsible admission policies and practices.
Collecting and disseminating information and advice.
top of page</p>

<p>College Admission Values
These values direct appropriate and effective college admission activities:</p>

<p>The benefits and predictors of good education are knowable yet practically impossible to measure.
Rankings oversimplify and mislead.
The student's skills and attitude contribute more significantly to quality education than does the college the student attends.
Educational values are best served by admission practices that are consistent with these values.
College admissions should be part of an educational process directed toward student autonomy and intellectual maturity.
Colleges can be assessed but not ranked. Students can be evaluated but not measured.
Students' thoughts, ideas and passions are worthy to be engaged and handled with utmost care."</p>

17

<p>Sounds like a bunch of claptrap to me:</p>

<p>"The benefits and predictors of good education are knowable yet practically impossible to measure." </p>

<p>So does that mean we shouldn't try to measure them, in order to make an informed opinion on what matters most--and what schools are most likely to offer what we consider important?</p>

<p>"Rankings oversimplify and mislead." </p>

<p>I think this statement is what is oversimplified. Rankings are meant to provide insightful advice on the quality of a school and program offered by that school. Obviously, the first thing everyone on this website wants to know is "Which school is better? Thus, rankings arise--to clarify a perceived preference based upon statistical data, not hearsay.</p>

<p>"The student's skills and attitude contribute more significantly to quality education than does the college the student attends."</p>

<p>This is the only one I agree with. </p>

<p>"Colleges can be assessed but not ranked. Students can be evaluated but not measured." </p>

<p>Really? So I guess that this whole education process--grades and all is just a shame?</p>

<p>I think the Peter Pan comment was closer to reality.</p>

18

<p>"Sounds like a bunch of claptrap to me"</p>

<p>Hope you are not trying to get into Kenyon, Reed, or University of Chicago, (among others) as their Deans of Admissions are all on the Advisory Board who came up with the "claptrap". </p>

<p>And once again.........DON'T KNOCK PETER PAN!!!!!!!!!!!</p>

<p>Oh....and as far as the ratings are concerned....guess what?</p>

<p>We all survived before they came into existence. Harvard was still Harvard, Yale was still Yale, Amherst was still Amherst! People actually were smart enough to know a good college from a bad college without having the numbers shoved down their throats. If you feel that you need to know whether your first choice school is #7 or #12 on some commercialized list, feel free to fork out the bucks to buy the books or subscribe to US News. This is what I mean by a superficial process.....</p>

19

<p>Sorry Calcruzer....I just noticed that you are a business major... :)</p>

20

<p><a href="waitlists%20should%20be%20for%20a%20select%20number%20where%20there's%20a%20good%20chance,%2050-50,%20that%20you'll%20actually%20get%20off">quote</a>.

[/quote]
I honestly don't blame colleges for waiting lists. Even at Harvard, only 80% of acceptees choose to attend. It can very unpredictable. You don't want your college overcrowded, but you don't want a ghost town, either.</p>