<p>My S is a sophomore and scored well on the PSAT but receives mediocre grades. He's a GATE student but a serious underachiever. Right now, he's getting a C in Alg. 2 and a B in Bio Honors. His school is on a block schedule and he only has 4 classes a day 2 of which are electives. He has always shown potential - just last week he won first place in a regional essay contest. As he read his essay to the large crowd, I couldn't believe it was him. The frustrating thing is that he doesn't sign up for these challenges - its always us or his teachers. When he refused to join the school band as a freshman, we put him in anyway and now he's one of their section leaders. His Engl teacher has been trying to recruit him for the newspaper staff because he's a talented writer but he shows no interest in signing up. I need other parents' advice - should I call his counselor up and put him in the newspaper class? This would mean changing his schedule and maybe even taking summer school to make room. I'm concerned because next year is his junior year and an important one.</p>
<p>The most appropriate solution would be to discuss his situation and come to an agreement on your expectations for him and his will to do so.</p>
<p>At this age “putting him in” an activity against his will is likely to backfire on you and on your relationship. My advice: sit down with him, explain what you expect and listen to what he wants. Make sure he understands that if he blows off activities and school work his Jurior year it may have very real consequences for his college applications but also let him know that you are willing to let him make his own decisions. Opening an account on collegeboard.com can help with helping illustrate your point as can having him target a school or two that interest him and having him read their admissions requirements.</p>
<p>After that then let it go. Northstarmom has several posts that talk about her sons which may be useful to you. You can use the advanced search feature and find them. Look for posts with similar themes to yours. She may wander over to this thread too. She gives marvelous experience-based advice.</p>
<p>Is he involved in any worthwhile activities at all? Don’t push him into the ones you want if he already is involved in something on his own terms. Even writing on his own is a good activity; it doesn’t have to be something he gets credit for.</p>
<p>For what it’s worth…
One of my sons is the definition of Newton’s first law. He almost always needs that push to do something, and then enjoys it and was glad I pushed.</p>
<p>This begs the question of what happens when I’m not there to push, but my point is that just because mom “STRONGLY ENCOURAGES” son to pursue an activity doesn’t mean he’ll resent it and fail on purpose once he gets into it.</p>
<p>I’m open to suggestions on how to back off and not end up watching these kids spend 4 years playing video games. For now, I still push S to “try” activities that I know he’ll enjoy if he tries. </p>
<p>At this point I also always remind him of the many things he didn’t want to do, but really enjoyed once he got there and did them (this isn’t all about big school choices. sometimes it’s going out to a movie with friends, or a concert at church, or whatever. he just doesn’t want to stop whatever he’s doing, even if it’s watching a stupid movie he’s seen 10 times, and start something else… OR he doesn’t want to stop watching long enough to think through an invitation to go for ice cream with friends, and realize he’d enjoy that… very frustrating)</p>
<p>Back to the OP - if she knows he’s talented, and, as his mom, really thinks he’ll enjoy the newspaper if he tries it, I think it’s not a bad idea to make him give it a try.</p>
<p>mom2three -you and I are raising the same S. Yes, push him. If he hates it then redecide. Nearly every interest my S has outside of video games is because I handed him the-snowboard, skateboard, guitar , rockclimbing lesson…and these are now his passions. Maybe it is a “type” or maybe it is a new computer age generation of S’s (along with being a “type”) but they need that extra push to get going. But once they start they go strong.</p>
<p>Here is what I did: I made a list of schools that my sophomore son would be likely to be admitted to with his current grades and even visited a few of them, even though I definitely did not want me child to attend those schools. Then I mapped out what it would take to get into another list of schools, one that was more attractive and included the types of schools my smart son’s smart friends would be likely to attend. The list included various activities that he could continue or not as well as what his GPA could be if he got all A’s, one B, etc. Lastly, and this turned out to be a colossal waste of money, I hired a private college consultant to guide him through the process so he would not be able to look back and ask why I didn’t do all I could to inform him of his choices. I never MADE him do anything. You cannot make a kid get good grades or join activities/community service they do not care about. He decided for himself that he would rather try to go to Berkeley (his original dream school, but not the one he ultimately chose) instead of Chico State. The grades went up. An upward trend can do a lot in college admissions.</p>
<p>lilmom, based on his grades and accomplishments it sounds like your son’s interests and talents lie in the Humanities, and not so much the sciences. . At this stage you probably know your son better than he knows himself, so continue to quietly push, guide, suggest options to him that will get him into activities that he enjoys and is good at. Sometimes these young talented guys don’t want to be considered “geeks”, because at this stage in their development it’s not “cool” to be smarter or to do different things than their friends do. </p>
<p>I had to do the same thing for my smart, but somewhat lazy S too. Because I only “pushed” the areas where he had shown lots of prior interest and talent, it turned out fine.</p>
<p>Thank you to everyone who’s replied. It was very comforting to hear from parents who are dealing with the same situation! We, too, have had to push (gently and not so gently) our son to try different things that he learned to love. I asked him today if he was interested in joining the newspaper staff because the deadline for changes was approaching. He smiled and said “I should do it for at least one term. My teacher’s been bugging me for a while.” Well, that was easy. I know that much of my son’s problem may be just a lack of confidence - we are trying to be patient hoping he’ll start making decisions on his own. But I’m a type A person…well, that makes it a little difficult. Thank you again everyone, especially Bessie, for the informative message. I will try some of your suggestions!</p>
<p>super-and bet he loves and is good at it! Might be shyness vs lack of confidence-they can look the same…</p>
<p>lilmom—we (as many here) faced (& sometimes still face) a similar situation.</p>
<p>One thing I’ve found helpful is that (similar to what oregon101 said) the root of son’s disinclination to participate is sometimes lack of confidence. To that end, I’ve focused on noting things he does well, showing my unconditional care for him, spending time w/him and trying not to get sucked into the spiral of: “why haven’t you done this? why aren’t you doing that?” It’s hard when they have abilities that they are not pursuing, but, ironically, backing off and encouraging the ‘foundation’ (esteem) can help.</p>
<p>Good luck.</p>
<p>Discuss with HIM something that is meaningful to HIM and let HIM decide what HE would like to do to make HIS mark on the world. </p>
<p>(Can you tell I have a boy of the same age? Micromanaging his life will sabotage him; showing you care about his personal goals will motivate him. It is legitimate to make sure that he knows what he can do, in a general way, to open up college opportunities and build a foundation for a future career.)</p>
<p>hmmm-tokenadult -I see how many posts you have and I am somewhat in awe-but I do not think your S and mine are at all alike. Mine is a smart kid who absolutely would never from a conversation- even one he participated in and we came to an agreement --would ever actually follow through. I do believe that being a more insistent parent is in the end best for a certain type of student. Esp. with all of the new research about young males and brain development- I hope as parents we come to accept that many of our S’s need more parental direction and even insistence until a later age that we previously thought. That said-yes, they will decide whether to perform and excel or not-and that we should not try to control.</p>
<p>Mom2three and oregon101: We all have the same S! My junior S rarely initiates anything. I dont like it but have learned to live with it. I have been fairly successful in strongly encouraging him to try various activities. I know him well enough to know which activities he may enjoy. I also do not get upset when he is adamant about NOT doing something I suggest. Yes, if I do not push him, he would have spent the last few years doing nothing but playing video games or daydreaming on the couch. </p>
<p>Tokenadult: Discussing the situation only works to a certain extent. My S honestly has no clue about what mark he wants to make in the world. He knows what he does not like but does not know all the things that he may like. After each discussion, he would say he will think about it but seldom follows up with action unless I push him. Sometimes I think he just doesnt see the point of putting forth the efforts. I do learn that I have to give him time to digest my persuasion and I have to be persistent. If he does not like my proposal #1, thats fine. Lets try proposal #2. If he has an alternative proposal, thats even better.</p>
<p>Interestingly, once my S tries something and likes it, he just incorporates it into his routine and doesnt even whine about it! He takes pride (and received full credit) for many things that are not initiated by him.</p>
<p>I realize S needs to grow up and decide for himself someday. However, before he is matured enough to get to that point, I try to create opportunities through which he can learn about his interests and his abilities. If it takes pushing, so be it. I believe each teenager matures at different rate. I look forward to the day when S tells me to bug off so that he can spend his time the way he sees fit (that is, except video gaming :)).</p>
<p>I have several children and they’re all different but I get further with negotiation (not because the kid won’t obey-- but because I get no inward pleasure making my son do something that is just a smokescreen for his own passion in life). I want my kids to find the direction for their own lives. So yes, if my son loves to write, I might really encourage him to try the newspaper class or I might get him a journal. But if my son likes computers, I wouldn’t sign him up for a newspaper elective; I would find out what he needs to take to be eligible for AP Computer Science. I am the biggest encourager in the world-- but I try to take my cues from them. (The times we have disagreed about class schedule was when they haven’t wanted to take a class that they need for the colleges or majors that interest them.) But to each his own. God gives us our children for a reason. Perhaps what works with mine won’t work with yours.</p>
<p>A really thought-provoking essay I just read about how parents communicate with kids. </p>
<p>[Lies</a> We Tell Kids](<a href=“http://www.paulgraham.com/lies.html]Lies”>Lies We Tell Kids) </p>
<p>It’s just a coincidence that I was just reading the essay and am now returning to this thread, but maybe there is food for thought for us parents in the essay.</p>
<p>I think it’s definitely think that encouraging your son is a good thing but you should also keep in mind the possibility of him developing a dependency on external influence to get things done (extra-curriculars, academics, etc). This can potentially cripple your son when he gets to college, where he has to take the initiative to do the things he would normally need pushing for.</p>
<p>What happens when you make the simple statement “I think you should give serious thought to working on the school newspaper. I think you’d like it and so does your English teacher. I’d love to sign you up for the class, but I need your agreement.” ?</p>
<p>Wait–has the teacher talked to him? I have a kid with some of the same tendencies and it almost always works better when a teacher tells him he has a strength and they’d love to see him try X. When I do it the response is always “well yeah, you’re my mom, you have to think I’m special.”</p>
<p>Perfectionists are often underachievers. If your son is bright, he may have gotten used to getting good results in elementary school with little to no work. If he has a mechanical or athletic talent, he may have had early success in a sport or other activity–again with little work. These early “wins” can be a bit insidious, as it creates a situation where a child expects a flawless output with very little effort, and failure or even mediocre results (grades, or getting cut from a team, etc) can be a huge shock. </p>
<p>I wonder if your son is very talented–you said he had to be pushed into band and ended up section leader. Did he work his butt off to be section leader once he was in band, or did it just happen due to innate ability? If the latter that isn’t good. He’s still not figured out the effort thing, and on some level he may know it and be terrified of trying something where his innate ability will not bail him out. </p>
<p>I would fine SOMETHING he is not good at and make him do that, rather than pushing him into things where he’s going to be really good with little effort. He needs to learn a couple of things before college: 1) working hard to master something is more important than the things you can master without a lot of effort 2) It is OK to be average at something–not everything can be perfect.</p>
<p>I’d also look for some resources on perfectionist kids and see if your son meets the profile, and if so how you as a parent can help him. The things we think of as “good parenting” can often undermine this type of kid and make them even more terrified of failure. I learned that I tended to give the wrong kind of praise–my son would often call himself stupid (he’s NOT) and I’d point out how smart he was when he’d do well. That was the worst thing I could have done–it is better to praise them when they overcome their fear of failure and actually put themselves on the line and try hard even if the result is not stellar. I learned to praise effort, not results, and I learned to help him set appropriate goals.</p>
<p>In the end, it will all work out. Keep repeating that mantra to yourself. I used to tell my friends with younger kids “Bribe, threaten, blackmail and mix it up so no one gets bored.”</p>