<p>“I teach developmental psych and I often tell my students that my second child (the son) helped me become a much better parent. With child one, everything has been smooth and, until I had the second child, I was foolish to think my parenting skills were outstanding and contributed to the success of child one. I now know that child one simply “came out of the box” that way and her successes have little to do with my parenting and a whole lot more to do with her temperament, her interests, and perseverance”</p>
<p>It’s scary that you TEACH PSYCHOLOGY and actually teach young, child baring age adults that their parenting skills have nothing to do with the success or failure of their children. Too much school has completely nuked your common sense? Talk about setting people up to rationalize being bad parents and convince themselves that their childrens’ potential failures, drug addictions, etc. in life have absolutely nothing to do with the lack of responsibility parents take in training their children to be good people. You get paid to teach this drivel? UGH!</p>
<p>To the original poster…again, tell your son to man up, get a job, pay his way through community college and re-apply. You will teach him a much more valuable lesson than if you treat him as a 10 year old and bail him out.</p>
<p>Now Tom
I don’t think she was saying she as a parent has no influence on her child’s behavior, she is just saying it is more work than she thought it was, since child #1 was a breeze. She found that her other child needed more and better parenting skills. Each kid is different. Anyone with multiple children will tell you this. Some are easy, some are not. I did not get from her post that you quote that she is advocating not parenting because a kid is going to turn out the way he is going to turn out no matter what so why bother.</p>
<p>And while I think your advice is appropriate for a lot of kids in this situation, we cannot be sure it is the right one for this kid. I think the OP will take everything she reads into the mix as she decides how best to handle her kid’s misstep to help him get back on the right track. </p>
<p>Things are just never as black and white as they may appear.</p>
<p>“teach young, child baring age adults that their parenting skills have nothing to do with the success or failure of their children.”</p>
<p>That’s not how I read it, but perhaps I’m “scary” s well. I think that anybody who has more than one kid, knows that kids can vary with regard to temperament.</p>
<p>Furthermore, parents effect kids AND kids effect parents. One of my favorite studies addresses how parenting strategies change in response to the CHILD’S treatment with stimulants. </p>
<p>Employing the same strategies to all children, as if they were all alike, doesn’t seem to work.</p>
<p>I won’t speak about individual scenarios, but in the BIG picture, taking all the credit, may be no more arrogant than taking all the blame.</p>
<p>Agreed with Shrinkrap. Parenting will not work with a “one size fits all” approach. My boys could not be more different. Strategies that worked with S1 will not work with S2. S1 went the CC route; I wouldn’t dream of sending S2 the same way because his needs are different.</p>
<p>Agreed with Tom that kids need to be held accountable for their mistakes and accept responsibility for their failures. They should not always be bailed out by their parents. </p>
<p>Our job as parents is to build a solid foundation for our children to grow and learn. But we cannot always take credit for their successes or accept responsibility for their failures. Only they can do that. I think that was the point that theorymom, hornet (#163) and Shrinkrap were making.</p>
<p>I was just browsing through this thread, and some doubts about going to college arose. </p>
<p>I am a year younger, having skipped a grade, and I will be barely 17 when I start (presumably) going to McGill. I still feel however fairly immature and uncertain about living independantly. </p>
<p>I have already applied, but if I feel that I am unable to perform well in university, at which point in time should I drop out (or take a probationary leave or something like that) so that I will be able to return to the same college without much hassle like the OP’s son?</p>
<p>While I am not familiar with McGill’s procedures, quite a few schools allow you to defer enrollment for one year after acceptance. I think this is an ideal way to mature a little bit and not have to go through the college application process when you are not currently in school. Do, however, plan a program or something to do for that year where you will just be sitting around “maturing.” :)</p>
<p>I agree with deferral. If you feel unready for college, it is best to take the time off before rather than wait until you are struggling and bail out. Gaining some maturity, learning to become more independent and self-reliant will all be good preparation, especially for McGill which is a large and highly urban university.</p>
<p>S is at McGill - If you are not ready, hold off a year. McGill is not a nurturing, hand-holding place. You will most definitely NOT have people looking out for you. You will be responsible for an incredible amount of work in freshman weed-out courses. You will be responsible for a ton of little things - like shopping for all your meals on weekends.<br>
If you have the awareness that you are not ready for this, do what you can to defer a year. McGill and Montreal offer a host of wonderful opportunities but they can be overwhelming.</p>
<p>It is really easy to misinterpret online writing and to be honest, that is why I have chosen to stay away from CC posts for a while. I do feel a need to clarify my intention and I also appreciate the posters who seem to have “gotten” what I wrote. Tom, I think you have misinterpreted the spirit of my post.</p>
<p>My intention was to support individuals in not feeling excessively responsible for the struggles of their children. In this age of hyper-parenting and parental competition, it is easy for one to feel horribly inadequate when their child struggles. In my lectures, I do not simply say “It is all genetics. Do what you want with your child”. My comments are issued in the context of a lecture on child temperament and the interaction between child and parent (“goodness of fit”, etc). I discuss discipline, the male crisis, ADHD. I could go on, but I hope you understand what I am saying. If you would like, I can provide you with many excellent references to read and I can certainly send my lecture notes to you in an e-mail or PM. I did not want to go into a lecture in this venue and my points were brief, perhaps to a flaw.</p>
<p>Essentially, the point I was attempting to stress is that in spite of our best efforts and careful parenting, children will struggle. It is easy to judge parents negatively when their children struggle. In academic communities such as the one I live in, it is difficult to find others who feel they can openly talk about problems such as this thread addresses. </p>
<p>My 17 year old has been carefully nurtured, allowed to fail when appropriate, provided with very little TV, no day care, friends, smart toys, LOTS of my time, excellent schools, a two parent non-drinking, liberal home and he still does not enjoy reading and academic activities. He is funny,smart, moral, good looking, non-competitive and genetically shy. He is also not ready for college next year.</p>
<p>Sometimes because of the way K-12 is structured we neglect to remember that “growing” is a holistic process. We went through this at age 4 with kindergarten readiness and how it is “more” than counting, knowing the alphabet and knowing shapes and colors and how it encompasses social and personal skills to be successful in kindergarten but we tend to quantify “college readiness” in the same aboslute terms as counting, knowing the alphabet etc. through SAT/ACT scores and GPA and neglect to consider the social and personal skills essential to be successful in college. Some of those skills you can’t teach or preach…it’s just the individual’s own maturation. I pretty much “got” what you were saying Hornet. My S1 was “ready” for kindergarten and “ready for college.” I’m grateful that S2 started first grade one year later and is going to college one year later I have witnessed huge personal growth between 17 and now and he will be 19 when he starts college.</p>
<p>I know this probably isn’t what you want to hear, but here’s what I did after I found myself in the same situation back in 2005.</p>
<p>I joined the Army. I’m currently writing this message from Afghanistan (my second tour), and I will complete my obligation in February 2011. If the Army has taught me anything, it is how bad life can be if you don’t go to college. I’m currently taking online classes on the Army’s dime and making straight A’s. When I get out I’m looking at transferring to some top schools, even with my old failing transcript from 2005. The Army won’t erase that semester, but it will give weight to my argument that I’ve changed. It is normal for the military to change people, the AdComs won’t find this hard to believe. I also have 2 years worth of combat to talk about in my essays.</p>
<p>I regret enlisting for 5 years, but I don’t regret enlisting. It was absolutely the right choice for me to make. I now desperately want to go to college, and when I do, Uncle Sam will foot the bill. The new G.I. Bill is amazingly generous.</p>
<p>I have been considering deferring admission for a while now; and it does seem like a viable choice considering my parents aren’t financially well imbursed right now as well as the whole maturity shebang. And, I have considered the Canadian Forces (Canadian parellel to GI Bill program); but unfortunately since I’m a new immigrant (Permanent Resident), I am unable to join. Oddly this rule was implemented a month before I visited the enrollement office and as such the website and all that data hadn’t been changed.
Well, I’m not sure taking a gap year would even be a smart idea some of the time, as how would one mature during a gap year? I won’t be around my friends much (most are going far), I’ll probably making minimum wage 9 - 5, I could take a couple of courses at my CC just for kicks and read a ****load,… But unless I get a job at an Adventureland like place (the place from Greg Mottola’s movie), I severly doubt I’ll be able to mature a whole load in the course of a year without the right environment. </p>
<p>Which leads me to ask the question, if I were to take a gap year, what is the right environment I sohuld immerse myself in to mature?</p>
<p>EDIT: McGill’s deadline for deferral is August 2010 for the Fall 2010 batch</p>
<p>Just go in knowing that you will have to schedule your study and be proactive about keeping up in class. Know that you will need to limit the socializing and drinking that you do, and work to establish relationships with profs and students who are serious about their educations. And if you do get in hot water and can’t dig yourself out… w/d before your transcript is all "f"s… You’ll be fine… ;)</p>
<p>Momofthreeboys, and I do agree that “we neglect to remember that “growing” is a holistic process”. I firmly believe that “education” isn’t just about academics. That’s why enrolled my kids in school to begin with, and sent them off to residential colleges. Four years of college is about academic goals and growth, but it is just as much personal growth. My son learned alot about himself in his first college semester. But the only thing that seems to matter is the final “F” or GPA on his record. My husband often comments that today, the penalties for the typical “mistakes” of youth are often far greater today than years ago. </p>
<p>We also tell our kids that they will most likely live to well into their 100’s, so pacing yourself, even in your youth, isn’t a bad thing. So, even in this challenging time we have to remember our advice.</p>
<p>Momofthreeboys, and I do agree that “we neglect to remember that “growing” is a holistic process”. I firmly believe that “education” isn’t just about academics. That’s why enrolled my kids in school to begin with, and sent them off to residential colleges. Four years of college is about academic goals and growth, but it is just as much personal growth. My son learned alot about himself in his first college semester. But the only thing that seems to matter is the final “F” or GPA on his record. My husband often comments that today, the penalties for the typical “mistakes” of youth are often far greater today than years ago. </p>
<p>We also tell our kids that they will most likely live to well into their 100’s, so pacing yourself, even in your youth, isn’t a bad thing. So, even in this challenging time we have to remember our advice.</p>
