It’s hard, I know, having been through this twice, but try to step back and let your daughter render her opinion. Try not to pollute her perceptions before they formulate.
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Agree. Stony Brook seems ideal, so I just assumed that you are from the Island and that it is too close. Albany and New Paltz are pretty cold. I’d look for scholarships at privates and out of state publics. There are many which would love to have a young woman like her as an engineering student and would be happy to give her a merit award.
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My DD had slightly higher stats than your DD and applied as a mechanical engineering major and received tons of merit aid from some great schools. Here’s some awards she earned off the top of my head:
Vanderbilt (full tuition Cornelius Vanderbilt merit scholarship); Case Western (close to 33k per year I think); Bucknell (I think over 30k per year); Stevens (their highest award–maybe $50k plus per year); USC (half tuition); Rice (15k per year); Boston Univ. (I think 20k per year), plus some others.
Granted, she put a lot of effort in to her essays (some awards required special essays) and it was a lot of work, but her efforts paid off. She had a lot of good affordable choices. She did have great EC’s which could have tipped the scale in her favor–who knows.
She had solid in-state options but she was very motivated to attend school out of state, so she cast a wide net and fished for the merit.
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You are spot on. Its a delicate balance. Based on personality, I knew I would have to at least get her going with a list of possibilities, hand it over to her, and then let her start driving. If the list changed 100% with good reasons, then I am absolutely fine with it. I just wanted to prime the pump to get things moving.
My concern is that she might not challenge my suggestions enough on her own. That she might not take the wheel fully, and rely on my suggestions too much.
A 3.98 and 1500 SAT.
The 3.98 alone puts her at $30K off ($8K tuition + room and board) at Arizona.
Alabama - including the SAT puts her at a couple thousand tuition. As an engineer, she’d get an additional $2,500 from the table I list below for her strong SAT.
UAH - a mid size school in fast growing Huntsville with a great rep.
These are just three - that she’s at $20K a year. There are many schools that have merit - auto or otherwise - from I read above Missouri Science & Tech to Mizzou - to regional schools like Hofstra and Bradley - which will show a price on their NPCs - as will Miss State.
There are schools like U of SC, Florida State (low 20s with the out of state waiver) - and schools that are full price that are reasonable like Florida and Purdue which is high ranked.
There are the Case, Rochester, School of Mines in Golden Colorado which is high ranked…many options where merit is possible and in many cases probable.
What is your daughter looking for in a school - from price to size to geography - urban, rural, etc.
Nothing at all wrong with a SUNY if that is right for your family. But there are other options for sure.
Out-of-State Freshman Scholarships – Scholarships | The University of Alabama (ua.edu)
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In looking for scholarships for a student from downstate NY which are no farther away than NY state schools, I’d start with those which are a notch below the Top 20 schools but which have well developed engineering programs. Lafayette College in Easton, PA is a well endowed college which fits the bill for that kind of school. On a visit to Lafayette, you could also visit Lehigh, only half an hour away in Bethlehem. Bucknell is 2 hours farther west in Lewisburg and the weather may be less to her liking, but it is a similar school with excellent engineering. A school which draws rave reviews from its students is Worcester Tech. It’s up north in Massachusetts, but it’s in a different weather pattern than upstate NY, so see if their weather pattern is to her liking. A hidden gem for engineering is Manhattan College up in the exclusive Fieldston/Riverdale neighborhood on the Westchester border. Stevens Tech across the river in NJ is a great school for engineering. You might consider Fairfield University as well, which has a smaller college of engineering but does have mechanical and is in a great location. She’d be well qualified for scholarship money there.
There are public colleges which might prove to be affordable. My cousin’s son from Syracuse got a full scholarship to University of Delaware, which has an enrollment of only 18,000 and great weather. He loved it there. With 60% of the students from out of state, it has more of the feel of a private college. Rowan University in NJ is up and coming in engineering. With a lot of investment in the past decade it’s engineering facilities are new and modern. NJ state college tuition is surprisingly affordable for out of staters and there are scholarships as well. Then there is Rutgers, bigger than the NY state research campuses, but broken up into smaller college units and has excellent academics. I’m sure that they’d love to have your daughter as a student. University of Maryland is farther away and has become quite competitive lately, but females in engineering are in demand everywhere - even MIT. UMD is worth investigating.
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When you say that you want the budget to be around SUNY prices, do you mean before any scholarships/grants for New York residents, or the sticker price for in-state residents?
How far away is she/your family willing to have her go? What kinds of things is she interested in? Any particular extracurriculars (whether in the area or at the campus)?
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SUNY generally give little to nothing in merit to in-staters. So 28-32 is generally going to be the all in number at all SUNY’s in 2022.
How far… really not specified, but plane travel has the effect of adding $5K to the total costs between flight, hotels, shipping and whatnot- so we are careful to consider it. It can really add up. And all things being equal- being able to get home easily is always better than not. So its a consideration- but not a deal breaker either way. She’d sacrifice the $, time and inconvenience all of that to go to Stanford for example (she isn’t applying- knows its out of her league) but not for UC Santa Cruz. No hard cutoffs- but their is a cost-benefit analysis.
She’d be fine at any campus- large or small. Not a sports nut beyond what she plays in HS. Her ec’s are really TBD because sports really occupied her time in HS, so their will be a void there.
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@tsbna44 offers very good suggestions for merit aid places. If she is at all inclined, I would take your daughter there for a visit or even go on their website first. If anything excites her, take her for a visit in the fall.
She might consider applying to Washington & Lee. 10% of the entering class gets the full ride Johnson Scholarship, which would drop her budget from 28-32K to free. W&L offers a general engineering degree, and the school has chosen for many years not to pursue ABET accreditation because of the restrictions in would place on their curriculum… but their program is very well regarded and their graduates place well. Also, the Lexington, VA weather would probably meet with your d’s approval, without being undriveably far from home. Since you seem certain she’ll pursue grad school, she’d have every opportunity to specialize more at that level. Engineering | Washington and Lee
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I tell all parents to add $3-5K to what you think it costs anyway - pizza, parties, trips, eating out because the dorm food is tired, medical - because the school clinic stinks, travel or otherwise - but travel alone should not be $5K - although emergency trips happen.
But how about a U of Cincinnati or Kentucky or WVU - these are closer - Or I mentioned others that will get you well below $28-32K. These would be “driveable”
Both you and your student have to be comfortable though - it’s hard for parents to have kids away and sometimes it’s hard on the kid.
Also check York College PA - which is low cost.
You might want to throw some flyers out to - the all or none - the Johnson Scholar at Washington and Lee (they purposely aren’t AEBET but have great outcomes as it’s an elite school) or SMU - both of which offer full rides - i.e. you pay not a nickel and even get other benefits.
Again, if SUNY is right for your child - it’s no issue - there’s a zillion great schools out there and plenty of successes come from all.
But - if you’re limiting yourself solely for financial reasons, I’d respectfully argue you could expand your geographic base and even beat the SUNY price you quoted - by a fair sum.
Good luck.
Love W&L but no mechanical engineering.
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I get the gist here. There are some flyers worth taking. It’s a luxury that comes with having a solid safety in place. Maybe one of them can become more attractive- and if they don’t- you are all good.
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I think I addressed that it would be general engineering rather than mechanical specifically. Since OP’s daughter isn’t 100% set on major, it seemed worth putting out there. Could still do a MechE grad program. The typical MechE core classes are all there: Physics and Engineering Degree Requirements : Washington and Lee University
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I can’t help at all with college suggestions. But I will say that it is easy to get caught up in the myth that the “prize” or goal for high achievements in high school is acceptance to a high ranking college or the highest school that student can get in to. But what are the real goals? Zoom out a little. An education that sets her up well for a career? Avoidance of student loans? A school where she will thrive? No parent should ever feel guilty for helping their student avoid student loans. Her hard work will earn her merit, with the right application list…that’s the ‘reward’. That’s real money to put to grad school and avoid student loans, which last a lot longer than the 4 years of college. And if she doesn’t end up in grad school, it’s still real money…which factors in to the long run for her.
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You are right- but it is an easy trap to fall into and a hard culture to push back on. Who among us hasn’t told their kid to work hard so they could go to a great college? we start that at a very young age, thinking nothing of it .
There are MANY great colleges, but rankings and whatnot make some feel greater than others. And when there is a perceived mismatch between student achievement and reputation of school attended, the questions can be tough. Maybe tougher, the obvious bewilderment of people who say “that great” while their face says you could have done better.
It take a certain kid and parent.
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There are many great colleges - you are correct. However, you pointed toward a SUNY for price point - so you’re past the prestige already.
So then it’s just a question of deciding - do you want to find other “equally” great colleges - perhaps higher pedigree and perhaps not - but equally great that might be out of that SUNY comfort zone…because you are right, if you make it through engineering ANYWHERE you’re a fine student and likely got a fine education.
And that’s where many of the suggestions come in - and the auto merits which are more than a few but Alabama, UAH, Arizona, etc. come in - and you’ll be cheaper than SUNY - and all well known schools and facilities - and you can even get your own dorm room if you want, etc. You know your offer before you apply.
Some schools are spending heavily to bring smart kids like your daughter in - so they can prop up their reputation - and so at these three and many more - the level of student you come across within the engineering program itself (maybe not the overall school) - is strong.
And there’s many others to hit your price range that might be variable merit - a South Carolina for example - so you don’t know up front the exact amount. Or a Colorado State. An Iowa State is another strong one many say is a “back up” to Purdue for example…very inexpensive.
But your daughter has choices should she want them.
This list of schools are those that would be within less driving time than it would be to get to SUNY Buffalo, all while feeling warmer than Buffalo. They’re all ABET-accredited for mechanical engineering and offer merit aid. I think your chances of getting the price to SUNY levels for many/most of these is good, and I think that your daughter would also stand a good chance at getting full tuition or a full ride at some of them as well.
U. of Hartford (CT): From its website, it appears that your daughter would be likely to receive at least $23k and would be competitive for a full tuition scholarship. The only concern would be maintaining an appropriate GPA, as she would need a 3.0 for the regular scholarship or a 3.25 for the full tuition one. But even being in the competition for the full tuition one would grant her an extra $1k on top of her other scholarships. There are other scholarships, like FIRST Robotics ($2k), ACE Mentor ($5k), Model UN, etc. Its Net Price calculator asks for academic info, so you’re likely to get a minimum merit aid estimate as well.
Merrimack (MA): I suspect your daughter would be likely to receive a President’s scholarship, which is up to $25k/year. Also, there are additional scholarships for for honors students ($1k, stacks), FIRST Robotics ($10k, stacks), choir, marching band, etc. The NPC does ask for GPA, so there may be merit scholarships included in the calculator.
U. of New Haven (CT): I bet your DD would be very competititve for one of the Presidential Scholarships which is for $23-28/year for up to 10 semesters (i.e. 5 years!). As its Net Price Calculator also requests academic info, I think you’d be likely to get verification of the minimum amount of merit aid your daughter would receive.
NJ Institute of Technology: Scholarships up to full tuition & fees and possible also full room & board (if a recipient of both the Honors Merit Award & Honors Residential Scholarship). Its NPC also asks for GPA and standardized test score data, so you should get a good idea of the minimum amount of merit aid she’d be likely to receive.
I don’t have time to delve further, but these are some other schools that I think are worth a good look, and they’re all ABET-accredited for mechanical engineering as well.
- U. of Delaware
- College of New Jersey
- SUNY Polytechnic
- Rensselaer Polytechnic (NY)
- Rowan (NJ)
- Rutgers (NJ)
- Stevens Institute of Technology (NJ)
- Thomas Jefferson (PA )
- Wentworth (MA)
- Widener (PA )
- Wilkes (PA )
- Worcester Polytechnic (MA)
- York (PA )
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If she ends up somewhere people might feel is beneath her, she can have a prepared response. DD’17 who went only to community college for a specific 2 year program, quit shrinking away from telling people where she was going and started telling them how excited she was for her program and her scholarships and no debt. She can lead with excitement and positivity regarding her choice.
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You did put that out there. Just wanted to make sure she understood that meant no ME. You’re certainly right that it’s a great school and graduates do very well coming out of there.