<p>Doogie311 I love you</p>
<p>AA should be abolished and replaced with a quota for low-income groups. End of story.</p>
<p>I am most definatly not a racist, I have African American, Asian, Caucasian, and hispanic friends so OK here it goes...</p>
<p>The United States is a free free market democracy that values hard work pretty much over everything else. AA is almost like putting a socialist spin on addmissions. There are 3000 odd schools in the country to choose from. No one group should have an unfair advantage if they could apply someplace else. Now, before everybody starts on me, I am comparing this to other countries. Every country has a group that is stigmatized usually to a larger extent. Most Americans will accept others if they agree to integrate into mainstream society. The Irish, Asians, Jews and others all faced discrimination at some point in time and they succeeded and integrated. Now, this is not to completly overlook any problems that blacks face. Around 9.8 percent of African americans in there twenties are in jail. Something has to be done, granted. However, much of the work has to come from the communities, with some help from the government, not reparations and AA laws from the federal government</p>
<p>Personally, I am not totally sure where I stand in terms of affirmative action. But if you think about it, what percentage of top tier schools are made up of minorities? The number is pretty low or else aa would not be necessary. So how many spots are minorities really taking away from "more deserving" white students?
When I received admittance into my high school, my classmates told me that the school only accepted me because I was black. I was a 4.0 student in middle school who consistently scored in the 99th percentile on standardized testing. I also was very involved in extra curricular activities. When I get into college, I fear that I will go through a similar situation. This makes affirmative action a hard issue for me to judge. But when I look at the public high schools in my very diverse city, I see many are filled to the brim with hispanic and black students while the private schools are filled with caucasian and asian students. The students at the private schools are ultimately receiving a better education but how do we resolve this issue?
Affirmative Action is a very complex issue and I believe both sides have valid points. But ultimately, this discussion is not going to change anyone's opinion. Therefore I believe we should be able to discuss this issue in a more civilized manner and not state that every generalization made is really racism. Maybe bad wording or lack of insight, but not racism.</p>
<p>
[quote]
I have showed you otherwise with solid statistics.
[/quote]
</p>
<p>You've shown correlations. You haven't shown causation. Big difference. </p>
<p>Either way, the fact still remains that even a black in a middle or upper-middle class household faces challenges that whites do not. Hell, as someone who is slightly "brown," I can attest to different treatment than some of my more "typically" caucasian friends. Unfortunately, you can't quantify this stuff, and those who don't experience it usually can't imagine it. However, let me repeat: blacks still face significant discrimination in society today. Anyone who says otherwise is just putting on the blinders. Now, is AA the answer? Maybe not. But to say that blacks have the same opportunities/are treated the same is disingenous. </p>
<p>And while I favor a socioeconomic verson of AA more than an ethnic version, let me ask you something: if a poor black man and a poor white man go to the same interview (same credentials), why is it that the white almost always wins out? I've read multiple studies showing there to be at least somewhat of a correlation.</p>
<p>In any case, I just find it hard to believe that a big lot of you guys honestly don't seem to believe that blacks in fair economic situations don't face challenges their white counterparts don't.</p>
<p>???????? You live in japan how could you know anything about that at all?</p>
<p>I'm sick of people complaining about complaining about Affirmative Action!</p>
<p>not really, but I'm tired.....</p>
<p>
[quote]
???????? You live in japan how could you know anything about that at all?
[/quote]
</p>
<p>Oh, I dunno, maybe because I lived the prior 21 years of my life in Los Angeles, California, New York, New York, and Washington, DC. But hey, what would I know, I'm only an American.</p>
<p>If you're going to make assumptions, at least make good ones.</p>
<p>I mean, really WoW4201, is that the best you can do? Lame.</p>
<p>Oh yeah!....well...you made a spelling error in your post UCLA....</p>
<p>hahahaha...got you there!</p>
<p>Not, really, once again, but it was worth a shot</p>
<p>squiggle22 I am in the same position as you. I actually am not sure where I stand on Afiirmative Action but I don't believe there is an extreme either way that will fix the "problem"</p>
<p>
[quote]
Oh yeah!....well...you made a spelling error in your post UCLA....
[/quote]
</p>
<p>That's because I live in Japan, you know. Because you know, if you live in another country, you obviously don't know your arse from a hole in the ground.</p>
<p>Ok...I stayed out of this for a long time but I feel I have something to say...</p>
<p>Instead of worrying about AA at HYPS-type universities, we should be worrying about preparing those students at economically disadvantaged schools (which, yes, many times include a high percentage of minorities) for college. Many times students at economically disadvantaged schools are admitted to college programs and don't have the base-line education to succeed in college and many times end up flunking out. They may be rising stars at their home school with great class rank and above-average SAT scores, however, they don't have the study skills or base-line education to succeed in the college environment to which they are admitted.</p>
<p>If we as a country can get economically disadavantaged students all an equal chance at secondary education, post-secondary education will inevitably follow. These students will then have better essay-writing skills, necessary for any college level writing class and also enabling better college enterance essay. They will have a greater command of basic algebra skills necessary for success in upper level math classes, namely the Calculus series. They will have better study skills in general because they will have to study hard to achieve good grades in high school.</p>
<p>I know this sound naive to expect this in our country, and yes, there are social issues that need to be fixed as well in our economically disadvantaged areas (such as lack of educational motivation), however, I believe that if we put a little TLC in caring for these students, as a whole they will perform better in college and will be able to get into college without AA. </p>
<p>Again, I'm not talking about top universities of the country, I'm talking about average people bound for average schools. Everyone should get an equal chance at succeeding at these schools, and that just plain isn't happening now despite AA. AA may give certain students the opportunity to attend a university, but it doesn't guarentee success while in tenure at that university.
And no, I don't support the No Child Left Behind legislation as is written, it has many flaws that is beyond the scope of this discussion.</p>
<p>That's my two cents...feel free to criticize but I don't see my opinion changing.</p>
<p>"That's because I live in Japan, you know. Because you know, if you live in another country, you obviously don't know your arse from a hole in the ground."</p>
<p>Dude that was caustic and all, but it wasn't very funny.....</p>
<p>At that point, I don't think my point was humor. Sorry if you were expecting a laugh. I just can't believe WoW suggested that even if I am from Japan that I can't have a good understanding of AA issues. That's like saying that I can't know what caused the American Civil War unless I lived during the era.</p>
<p>well actually....</p>
<p>.</p>
<p>.</p>
<p>.</p>
<p>lol im just kidding UCLAri but you obviously couldnt see the sarcasm which I didnt want you too but you no Im kidding alright?</p>
<p>Sarcasm and teh Internets = bad combination.</p>
<p>It seems like this thread has officially gone off topic. I guess that is a good, thing, however, because nothing was really getting accomplished.</p>