Please Help

Parents Forum
1

<p>Sorry for double posting...I ended this post in a previous thread...but doubt the subject heading caught anyone's attention.
Thanks</p>

<p>It's been a long year and well I'm back with good and bad news seeking some advice once again.</p>

<p>The medical issue resolved-- he had been diagnosed as diabetic in the fall-- but with massive weight loss and exercise, he's actually doing fine-- he doesn't need insulin and he's eating well - amazing (although we must be reminding him constantly to avoid carbs/sweets).
The Physics class at the high school was dropped and he has been self studying for a few months and taking a class at local CC.
He is accepted to 5 colleges total-- all notified of the change in how Physics was being achieved-- no concerns. Down to deciding between two schools --1 week left!</p>

<p>Ok- that's the good news...and now the bad.
Other than an "A" in Calculus, he blew third quarter (C, D, D in other classes)...and has essentially been acting "immature" and "unfocused" since January...he plays video games
endlessly- hours upon hours. Most ECs went away...yes, it looks like depression - or it could be acute senioritis given the early college acceptance? He doesn't do too much else other than video games and one school club after school...we thought it was depression and he eventually he agreed to some counseling a few weeks ago after refusing to attend school. He stopped counseling last week aburptly, exhibited uncharacteristic behavior-- breaking several expensive things he owns and some of ours (he repaid for all of this with his earnings). (Therapist diagnosis code: "Adjustment Disorder"...isn't that fancy lingo for immature?))!
He is days away from final exams in AP classes and AP exams and shows no signs of studying for anything. He even announced yesterday he is not taking his final exam and it's his choice. (he would by default fail the course which is not needed to graduate- but clearly he would be rescinded unless we document a medical illness).
My husband and I disagree about the proper response. I think he should be restricted from video games (at the very least) and perhaps even institutionalized at this point- at the very least- have a psychiatric exam. I suppose he could just be a serious jerk - terribly immature and well, he'll head off to college and once away from his "nagging mom" he will do fine. That is a best case scenario-- reality, he could commit suicide. (Therapist swears he hears/sees no warning signs of that). Husband says-- let him hit rock bottom and fail- then he'll get help. That comes at a hefty price-- declared mentally incompetent, doesn't graduate high school and then forget about college.</p>

<p>How do we know when to back off and let him fail - has anyone been through similar? Anyone had a child with a diagnosis of "adjustment disorder"? Or should we keep talking /advocating with the high school and get him graduated ...and then the bigger issue, feel safe (when my gut says no) to sending him off next year. He says he has no interest in a gap year-- wants to head off -- and we are talking about schools on the top 10 list for engineering.</p>

<p>Immediate problem-- what to do when he cuts school on final exam Monday?</p>

<p>HELP!!</p>

2

<p>Wow, you have your plate very full right now. I’m sure you’re very stressed by the situation.</p>

<p>He says he wants to head off next year to college, but does he understand that you will not let him do that if he does not attend his high school classes? If he cuts his final exam have you let him know that he will not be allowed to go away to college in the fall (at least not on your dime)? What is his response?</p>

3

<p>The adjustment disorder sounds like more of that psycobabble stuff. Perhaps it is part looking to be independent and part pressure of leaving home. As a teen his brain is not fully developed and he could just be acting in an illogical manner. I have a kid that is gaming all the time but is getting strong grades. We tried to get him to cut down and be more balanced but he flipped out. So now we just keep the peace hoping to just get him off to college next year. He has HPY plans but I dont see it materializing due to the lack of focus that the gaming creates. We also are hoping that he matures and gets tired of the gaming and that once he is at college then the environment will force him to move along. Difficult to sit gaming and being reclusive and difficult if all your peers are doing more interesting things. That is our strategy anyway. I would just try to move him along peacefully and NOT blow the process up. This assumes that there is not some more significant issue driving his behavoir.</p>

4

<p>Thank you- yes, enormously stressed-- thank g-d he’s the last child at home!</p>

<p>Well, actually we spoke about the option of no money for college…a few months ago…he actually had the nerve to say he’ll call our bluff …this during one of his moments of thinking unclearly followed by garbage out of his mouth. </p>

<p>Reality- our EFC was mid teens and well, believe or not-- he also won a prestigious external scholarship- leaving the balance about $6000 - of which he says he’ll borrow if we don’t pay. So - in fact Fall semester does not have to be on my dime at all. He however doesn’t turn 18 until late December-- so I suppose I could refuse to sign the forms… but my husband (and I don’t know how long that is going to last) would likely sign the forms. He however has sit back and watched months go by - saying let him fail and then he’ll seek help…he however, doesn’t get the magnitude of the situation -this kid has been accepted to some seriously highly rated engineering programs- you don’t throw that away b/c a kid is immature-- but you do throw it away if in fact he’s mentally ill …hence the dilemma-- is he mentally ill? He isn’t getting any more help voluntarily-- leaving us forced with forced help as the only option.</p>

<p>So technically to answer your ?- we have absolutely no financial hold over him.</p>

<p>Obviously, if he fails the exam or fails to take the exam, he would clearly be rescinded.
There’s a part of me that wants to believe every person I’ve spoken too having a 20 something male who went through reckless behavior at one point-- that this all ends, guys just make stupid stupid stupid choices at this age and eventually things even out.<br>
That said, My gut tells me I’ll find him mid fall semester failing all his classes, playing video games, gaining back all the weight and becoming ill again or worse yet,- he commits suicide. This is why I’m completely stuck as to whether to have him institutionalized-- which I know is VERY Extreme.
I could sit back- he fails everything…reality-- with the A’s he mustered up in the first two quarters-- if he did nothing else for the year, he’d get a pile of Cs and Ds…and graduate…and we could probably get medical documentation to avoid his being rescinded wherever he goes.<br>
But he needs help? Or doesn’t he?
Should I just back off - try to stay calm while he sits in his room playing all those horrid shooting military games?</p>

<p>Part of me has pity- if he’s mentally ill- he needs my help…
part of me furious-- if it’s just his hormones and he’s an immature jerk (not the same person he was 8 months ago for sure) – i’d just assume kick his ass out the door early June - diploma in hand or no diploma in hand…</p>

<p>Anyone else had a diagnosis of “adjustment disorder”?</p>

5

<p>mxjeff…you are absolutely a much more calm person than I am… I know that is probably the right thing to do…just ignore it…
He has told both of us he’s convinced he’s going to earn a 5 on his exams…i shouldn’t doubt him…he got 3 of those last year and was playing video games then too…</p>

<p>The two Ds were the last straw that has me panicked…reality-- I will let you all know if he took the final…</p>

<p>Empty nest 3 months and counting…one way or the other…Overachieversmom morphs into coldheartlessmom…hope not!</p>

<p>Agree with you-- i googled that diagnosis code on my bill…it sounds like an expensive way to call a kid an immature jack-ass! But there are warning signs of depression…seems to me 7 hours of video games a day is a depressed state…but that’s another thread entirely…</p>

6

<p>It is difficult to follow what is going on. If you can fill in some of the blanks, better advice can be offered. You said that he had a “massive” weight loss. How significant was it? How are his eating habits now? Does he get any exercise? You said that he plays several hours of video games a day, but that he also played quite a bit last year. How much has this changed? Does he socialize with friends? Did he socialize last year? You alluded to problems with your husband…“and I don’t know how long that is going to last.” I’m not sure what you mean by this. Is there stress in the household, aside from your S’s issues? Is your S affected by this?</p>

7

<p>you and your husband should meet with his therapist immediately and ask for guidance as to what to do - there are some pretty big stakes here, the biggest is not graduating from high school. the 3 of you may need to come up with a plan of action, and consequences.<br>
then, set up an appointment with the 2 of you and your son with the therapist and all hash it out together, and present your plan of action as a team to your son.</p>

<p>do this with a therapist. there is the definate possibility of mental illness here, and we are parents are not equipped to know how to best handle that. Your son may need professional help. and even if he is just being a jerk, may benefit from professional help.</p>

<p>suicide, and diabetes, is NOTHING to play around with. </p>

<p>good luck.</p>

8

<p>Why haven’t you disconnected the video game systems and donated them and the games to a youth center or thrown them into the dump? Why do you enable him to continue to waste his time playing video games while living under your roof?</p>

9

<p>I am certainly not it the least bit qualified on the mental illness part, but just reading your initial post again and the gut reaction I have is that the kid is just feeling worn out from the whole 4 years of scholastic performance and the illness. Sometimes you can push too hard as a parent and kids need to be kids. I want to push my kid as hard as anyone but sometimes you are dealt a hand that your have to play. We all don’t have the perfect child and student. Consider that if you take too drastic a stance that you could force him into a drastic response. Then you will be faced with having to repair some fairly significant relationship issues. If it is not drugs, bullying etc. then just keep the household in tack and positive and move him along. Try to be positive and get him to show more responsibility for his grades so he doesn’t get recinded. I have an older son that is a 2nd year engineering major and that major is very difficult. He will have to get it together in a few months when he starts school. Move him along. If he fails at college then you will wind up with him at home trying to recover. You get to the same place assuming you would leverage him now and he refuses to go off to college. BUT, if you are successful in getting him back on track then you both win with the path of least resistance. FWIW.</p>

10

<p>@gourmet mom
He socializes with friends-- does this after school in a club he stuck with, sees friends playing pick up sports on weekends and hanging out…so he isn’t a recluse…although I do know from the mom of one close friend (who obviously broke my son’s confidence) that he was devastated when he finally mustered the courage to ask out his first “crush” flat out rejected him unkindly apparently in a FB message.
He played video games last year-- but a bit less – now it seems to be an avoidance issue to working.
He does exercise-- although not as much as he did-- only once or twice a week in pick up Basketball…
Weight loss was gradual - not sudden - planned with a nutrionist…he lost 35 pounds, needs to loose another 20…he just put on another 7 last month…which is when the video gaming seems to have gotten worse.
My comment over husband was b/c of how we are disagreeing and arguing over S (not in front of him or when home)…I’m frustrated over the entire situation. </p>

<p>@ bayarea…we did spell out consequences with therapist… herapist said S should (and which he agree) to assume responsibility for and consequences of his poor school habits…so we all sat back and watched…and then the Ds came in on the third quarter report card. Last week he was so angry and rageful when we questioned him that he trashed his room in the rage…didn’t go to school …then went to the therapist and flatly refused to return …
This is where my husband and I disagree - he says we cannot force him…I think the kid cannot have it both ways-- if he’s mentally ill, he’s a minor and we can force him…if he’s just immature-- then we should throw him out…and my husband says – well - he’s not well, …so frustrating!</p>

<p>@ ny-- that is the problem !! my hsuband and I disagree. I said a minimum turn them off and out they go…but my husband said that is going to change his behavior- he isn’t going to study-- I say, how do you know?</p>

<p>Oh - eating habits…variable recently-- and clearly I observe he is more hostile and grumpy when he’s eaten carbs…he refuses to have more blood work done for a follow up - he’s scared of needles…another problem. The fear of needles was what prompted him to spend the past few months loosing weight and dieting - b/c he didn’t want to remain a diabetic and have to test daily and inject insulin…so he cleaned things up-- and now he thinks he is fine…</p>

<p>Ah - so far unanimous language-- don’t lock him up for a psych exam and sit back and allow him to tumble into his own outcomes…
maybe I am too emotional …</p>

11

<p>How does he plan on borrowing $6,000 at the age of 17? </p>

<p>Have you discussed deferring his admission for a gap year?</p>

12

<p>I’m not sure why you think he is mentally ill but perhaps there is simply not enough information here. If he is diabetic because he was obese then why not invite him on a daily walk. You can take the time to just talk and see if you can figure out what’s going on. Maybe your husband can walk with him sometimes. Both my older boys changed pretty dramatically at around 17. They went from “young” people who were quite compliant with us to fairly ornery and rebellious teens for a couple years only to come home after college freshman fall back to their “normal” selves. The only way you are going to figure some of it is if you can get him alone and talk. With regard to the apparent disinterest in school…I have no suggestions. You hate to see your kids create their own failure especially in their senior year. My middle son did drop Physics because he wanted an “easier” senior year, but it did not impact his college situation. I would perhaps attempt to remove the computer distractions, video games etc. until the grades are back where he is not an issue. Good luck!</p>

13

<p>I’m not an expert, but it seems as if his diabetes is not under control. Either that, or he has started to do drugs or drink. Even with the senioritis kicking in, and the GF rejection, this kind of dramatic change in behavior in a short time (the hostility, especially) is most likely biochemical. The fact that it correlates with a 7 lb. weight gain in one month is suspicious.</p>

14

<p>I think you have the source of your sons issue. The crush that unkindly rejected him is it. And using FB is even more devastating because it is made public and he is humiliated. He is feeling bad about himself and with all those raging hormones and emotion, he is just moping badly. Perhaps you should get him distracted by going away on the weekend for a trip or some other event that changes his envoronment. Perhaps invite one of his friends so he can get some time away.</p>

15

<p>If he has C’s and D’s on his final semester report card, you may not have to worry about him going anywhere, his acceptance may be rescinded. Where had he decided to go?</p>

16

<p>@nysmile
There are stafford loans in his package…are you telling me that he cannot sign the promissory notes…that’s interesting. He’s set for the first semester…the external grant will cover things… and he plans to work this summer…he’s been applying to jobs…one of which is to work at the local gamestop! (Like an drunk working in a bar).</p>

<p>@Mom of three boys…he joined a pricey health club for 3 months and lost his weight working out nearly 5 times a week…then he stopped around February. So I didn’t continue paying the hefty monthly fee…I asked him to join the dingy place i go to (i’ve worked there for years…I like it better) which is 1/3 the price…he refused…so he’s not doing anything except the b-ball. I invite him to come as my guest all the time… says he’s not interested.
Yes, I totally understand that boys change dramatically - my gut still tells me more is at stake here, diabetes can do alot of damage. In the few times we are trapped in the car together…he occasionally opens up-- clearly a very different person now-- having loads of confidence issues about his looks, his weight, and says he isn’t well liked…these are sad thoughts which worry me that he’s suicidal…but the therapist says after two months of visits-- absolutely not… (the guy has years of experience and comes highly recommended-- so I hope he’s right! – but my gut agrees with the next poster…</p>

<p>@ mom to 2
My thoughts exactly…my gut tells me it’s biochemical…perhaps the insulin levels are not under control and the mood swings go with it… but he refuses to return to get blood drawn…my husband will not help with this either…in our state, at 17 he is entitled to refuse medical treatment …but we can at 17 have him taken in for a psych exam…trust me, we have a very close family friend who is an attorney-- I talked to him about my options.</p>

<p>I would love to think when school is over in June he will get a job, get back to the gym and prepare himself mentally and physically for college - chill out and relax…</p>

17

<p>Help him find something to look forward to. What are his summer plans? Does your family ever do anything fun?</p>

<p>His life sounds like a depressing grind right now. It’s end of senior year, and everyone at school is talking about prom and senior parties. </p>

<p>Do you have the money and time to book a summer trip? For example, my son would enjoy hiking/backpacking with his Dad or a friend in the Rockies.</p>

<p>Your son sounds like he feels a bit trapped. And I can usually tell when my son is depressed. Out comes the World of Warcraft. It happens about once a year.</p>

18

<p>[Frequently</a> Asked Questions](<a href=“http://ed.gov/offices/OSFAP/DCS/faqs.html]Frequently”>http://ed.gov/offices/OSFAP/DCS/faqs.html)
^I always thought that one needed to be 18 years of age to enter into a binding contract, but I may be wrong in regards to Stafford loans. I found this link and my interpretation is that 17 year olds can indeed get these loans now without a co-signer and will be fully responsible for repayment of loan. Read the part about “Infancy”.</p>

19

<p>It might help immensely for all three of you to go to a therapist together. Tell S that you need help in understanding how to “hear” him and that if you all go that it could help you understand when to dial back. </p>

<p>Many teens put their parents over a barrel. They know their parent love them and every parent is frightened that the kid will a) run away and take up drugs/prostitution or b) commit suicide. So the teen acts ugly and the parent is afraid to draw a line (as you would do if your life partner were totally rude and destructive to you.</p>

<p>So, in the presence of the therapist, you need to lay out that you feel this is happening. That your teen is using major threats to get his way and that it makes you afraid to put down guidelines – but that you also know your S and know that this is not the man he wants to be: someone who bullies to get what they want. </p>

<p>Point out (again, with therapist present) that all three of you are on the same page. All three of you (parents, teen) want S to be a competent, happy adult who is capable of paying his own way and running his own life. What you are not in agreement on is how to get there. Say that absolutely everything is on the table. For instance, you could agree to a six weeks full of gaming/time off this summer if he’ll finish HS. </p>

<p>What teens are wary of (and appropriately so) is that parents will agree to A and then want to tack on B,C,D, E and so on until the teen is back to being overwhelmed and exhausted. </p>

<p>What can be helpful about a therapist or a negotiation advisor is that people can often open up and say to a third party what they have a hard time saying face to face. </p>

<p>One of my challenges as a mom is that I am articulate and I tend to rush in and try to “Solve the problem” – I’ll hand out a laundry list of options and be ready to march on immediately. I (and many females) tend to get to a solution by talking out the options. My guys are different. They tend to think, then talk. So I have to learn to ask a question and then sit (on my hands and tongue!) until they formulate a reply and actually articulate it. </p>

<p>I am working to learn interview techniques. Instead of asking “how was your day?” (answer: Fine or OK) I try to remember to say “Tell me what you did in chem today” or “What’s stressful right now?” Then I have to not jump in and offer “Solutions” and “improvements.”</p>

<p>You could say to S, “hey, how we are living is not working out. I’m stressed, Dad’s stressed and you are clearly unhappy. Do you want to take incomplete’s this spring and stay home and rest? You could graduate later. . . what do you think?” Just putting that on the table may make him feel a lot better. </p>

<p>He’s actually younger than many going off to college. He could take I’s now, rest up, finish later and either enter college in January or next summer or a whole year from this fall. The world will keep turning.</p>

20

<p>Interesting that being in the car opens up the conversation. In that position, neither person is dominant (one person tends to dominate in a face to face exchange). The two/three of you may do better in other side by side situations. Go walk the dog. Watch TV together. Put the patio table out back in a way that all three of you are looking out at the view. Tell H and S why you are doing this. Say that you need practice to “hear” your son. He will appreciate that you are trying. </p>

<p>Also, go into the gaming room and ask him to teach you how to play some of his favorite games. You will stink at this. But he will be an expert at the game and it will be a nice role reversal. He’ll be telling you what you are doing wrong and what you should do differently. You may be amazed at how irritating it is to be on the receiving end of “helpful” advice while you try to figure out how to zap the alien. Tell him when you reach that point and laugh together. </p>

<p>Laughing together is also wonderful. Get tickets for all three of you to go to a comedy show. Go to something HE would choose (even if its raunchy).</p>