<p>nightowl1 u need 2 chill. The schools you’re looking at have single digit acceptance rates. They’re a crap shot for everyone calm down. SAT scores really aren’t the be all end all. As long as you’re in range they really don’t matter anymore. Also, why are you even in the African American Students section what do you hope to accomplish here?</p>
<p>nightowl1, I don’t think you quite grasp what a “quota” is. Also, I don’t think you quite understand that a private institution doesn’t have to adhere to your idea of fairness.</p>
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What you’re doing is being a typical ■■■■■. There are some smart people who have views similar to yours, and many of them can and do discuss this topic in a civil manner (check out the lengthy Race in Admissions discussions). What you’re doing is essentially race-baiting.</p>
<p>I actually agreed with some of the things you said. I just pointed out that you are acting like a ■■■■■. And that’s no lie.</p>
<p>To anybody else reading this: I know you really shouldn’t feed trolls by responding to their provocations. But sometimes I can’t help myself when one is particularly…well, you fill in the blank.</p>
<p>The joker is a person trying to denigrate the achievements of black students who work hard and excel academically then are rewarded for it by admissions to elite colleges. He assumes that these students were all given a gift from white-guilted admissions officers and that white people gave away something that should’ve been given to white people. </p>
<p>This is why any attempt to communicate yields nothing of substance. This joker sees a black student on campus and assumes he or she doesn’t belong. He assumes that the president and First Lady didn’t deserve admission although I say that the ability to graduate is proof of worthiness to admit all by itself. The fact that black students make up a paltry 5%-8% of a freshman class at an Ivy League school is offensive to this guy. It represents one less “deserving” white person in a class full of them.</p>
<p>Racist-a person who believes that one’s race is superior to others.</p>
<p>The view that blacks at any Ivy League school are only there because a school chooses to overlook their inferior stats fits that definition of racism and “denies” the truth of the matter which is that these schools are accepting black students with stats in the lower, middle and upper percentiles of all accepted students of every race of applicants including “undeserving” white people with scores below 2050 on the SAT.</p>
<p>How does this happen? </p>
<p>Well, Madaboutx, part of the problem is that it’s pretty much demonstrably true that the very most selective colleges admit some URM students with lower than average stats because they affirmatively want more URMs on campus. They say that they do this, and the numbers bear it out. This doesn’t mean that those students are undeserving, that they are incapable of succeeding, or that they aren’t very impressive individuals. They are. And it doesn’t mean that all URM admits have lower than average stats–there are many who would be admitted anyway.</p>
<p>But not all. And some people just cannot stand that. Just as some people can’t stand that athletes get recruited, or that legacies get an advantage, or that rich people get an advantage. The colleges have reasons for doing all of these things, and they don’t much care that somebody thinks it’s “unfair.”</p>
<p>My view on this is that when somebody comes whining that URMs with lower stats are admitted to Harvard because of affirmative action, you should say, “Yeah, tough for you. Here’s a towel to mop up your tears.”</p>
<p>Hush, the big kids are talking now.</p>
<p>Finally, somebody has come to CC who claims to be “Imparting valuable and accurate information.” Whew, I can finally sleep at night. (
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<p>nightowl1, if one of those high SAT scores was yours, perhaps you could use your excellent verbal skills to look up what “race baiting” is.</p>
<p>I will agree to being kind of pathetic, though, since I’m wasting my time arguing with you.</p>
<p>zzzzzzzzzzzzzz :-@ </p>
<p>@Hunt you hit the nail on the head and that is a fair conversation to have versus what one person is in here trying to do. </p>
<p>Whites with lower SAT scores also get in because there are preferences for low income students too. Men get a little preference because women are doing better academically as a group than men. Or, an allowance may be made for kids from Iowa, Idaho, Alaska and Montana to ensure representation in the student body.</p>
<p>These are all conversations that can be reasonably discussed and intelligently debated. And like you, It doesn’t bother me much one way or another. Also, I think a student body that is representative of our diverse nation is a wonderful thing. Lastly, if the school deems a person qualified by the fact of admission of that person, what kind of dope would argue against that? The school accepts students it deems qualified and acceptable and likely to both contribute to & benefit from life at the university.</p>
<p>If a student is admitted, the student rightfully deserves to be there unless their behavior subsequently proves otherwise. That means that all this discussion about SAT scores of “admitted” students is worthless. Just like a rejected student that feels like they deserved admission is also worthless. The school is the final arbitrator of who deserves or doesn’t deserve anything.</p>
<p>I heard a TV judge once say “I’m not final because I’m right, I’m right because I’m final.” Amen.</p>
<p>Too bad that ivies don’t admit solely on the size of ones ego, eh?</p>
<p>I don’t know why I too get sucked in by trolls.</p>
<p>How did someone so arrogant slip thru the admissions crack? Dude proves why admitting solely based on a number is stupid. And it’s not even the highest score that can be attained.</p>
<p>@Madaboutx, I guess adcoms do occasionally get it wrong.</p>
<p>Actually it is higher and I would love to congratulate someone like you on your accomplishment. However, I am very likeable which seems to be of high importance for success in life. </p>
<p>Being smart is great but not everything. I actually hope you learn that in time to make a change in your attitude. </p>
<p>@nightowl1, your debate centers on the concept of “fairness.” A concept so biased in definition that you appear more and more desperate rather than someone with a cohesive opinion.</p>
<p>You also mention URMs being “unqualified,” but the data (something in 7 pages of discourse you refuse to address) regarding success and graduation rates do not substantiate your viewpoint. The top schools are all of the position that SAT scores/GPA are only a PART of the admissions decision. After a certain benchmark ALL students are qualified - there are no studies showing statistically significant differences in college performance. </p>
<p>Holistic admissions looks at the entire PERSON. What do they bring to campus? What particular achievements will make them a valued member of the class? I am honestly surprised your smug attitude got past the admissions committee. You must also be bringing something to desirable to campus other that stellar test-taking. </p>
<p>There are plenty of anecdotal stories regarding perfect/near perfect test scorers not being offered acceptance anywhere. The debate over whether the ivies should be offering acceptance based only on test scores has been bashed about ad nauseam on cc - as a new poster you might want to check out past threads.</p>
<p>I will be sure to share this exchange with my D, should she run into you and others with this attitude. I’m sure her 2 gold medals in speech and debate from Academic Decathlon will come in handy. Those wins are based on facts and the art of persuasion.</p>
<p>Hahahahahahaha!!! </p>
<p>I think the cancer in this country is people who pick fights, arguments and debates with people who are just trying to work hard and live their lives.</p>
<p>[When I said “actually it is” I meant that your score actually is better than my score. It really doesn’t matter what I scored in my life, I’ve started businesses, moves up the corporate ladder, invested successfully and have a good life and never once has my SAT been used for or against me in the process. It’s good for you though.]</p>
<p>I’m done. I violated my own advice to disengage. You can say whatever you want from here on out. Bye, bye. </p>
<p>@nightowl1, I’m not in the slightest bit concerned, thick-headed bullies also get what they deserve. </p>
<p>In post #96 you wrote about “the effect of admitting unqualified kids…” You continued with “kids like me who are ‘wicked smart’ … setting the curve, it can be demoralizing…”</p>
<p>Again, you ignore EVIDENCE to the contrary. These students will NOT perform in any way lesser than you. I wish I could be a fly on the wall to witness the reality in the coming years.</p>
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<p>I guess it’s true that stats aren’t everything.</p>
<p>By the way, my son got 2390 in a single sitting, and I got a 1530 before the recentering–plus we went to Yale, as opposed to the “lesser Ivy” where you (supposedly) go, and we both think your argument is fallacious. And we both support affirmative action for URMs, even though we’re white. So there.</p>
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And furthermore, this is what noob ■■■■■■ always say after they’ve been pwned.</p>
<p>So what about extracurriculars for admitted African American students. I personally have some good/sold=id ECs, like teaching English and health to my village in Sudan, being officer of various school clubs, concert master and section leader in music, internship, lots of volunteering, and having undergone hardships (sibling passed away), but do most have totally stellar ECs? I feel like mine are a bit mundane, and not enough awards</p>