Motivation would have to be internal by this point. Either he decides to step up, or he doesn’t, his choice. It really isnt up to other adults to find ways to prod him.
@JGmom20 Why was this school his “dream” school. Did they have a major he loved or a sports team? Did someone in the family sell him on it or go to it?
OP- you sound frustrated. I am too, when my kids lie- I don’t know if I am more frustrated that they are lying or that they are terrible at it. I also find our ability to use technology for information both a blessing and a curse. I shouldn’t know where my adult child is every second of the day, nor every grade they have, and yet, I could. I often have to remind myself that my parents didn’t have any of this- and I was thankful for it- so why should I do this to my kid. I think we as parents sometimes have nostalgia thinking- I have no idea what my GPA was in college- but I bet it was lower than I would have liked or expected of my kids- I know that’s true for high school! I blew off class all the time in college, but if my kid skips, not only do I know it, I get frustrated by it! I’m sure most of us didn’t know all of our grades, but now we instantly know- I can see my D18 grades and assignments- I have to choose not to look. Again, I am so thankful my parents didn’t have this ability- it would have driven me nuts.
As I suggested before, I hope you have an honest conversation with your son. Let him know you’ve been checking up on him. Ask him if his “dream” school still is his dream school. Just because you love their sports team, doesn’t mean it’s the right school academically. Let him know that you expect improvement and if you want, offer to pay for the tutor. Give him a realistic timeline to improve, by end of Spring. Let him be the adult and succeed or fail.
Then stop tracking him to catch him in a lie. Stop worrying about superficial things like clubs (why does that even matter), or how he spends his time ( I am amazed at how none of these kids seem to leave their rooms- my D has really met no one on her hall- blows my mind) and his appearance ( I have one that wears a dress every day and one that loves athletic shorts- and none of that determines what grades they get!). His appearance says nothing of you or your parenting skills. If it were me I wouldn’t care if my kid graduated from Harvard or No Name University as long as they were happy and competently completed their degree. I don’t use where they go as a bragging right. Just because he doesn’t get a degree from a T50 school doesn’t mean he won’t be successful. A lot of kids grades go up once they are in their major because they are taking classes that are interesting and meaningful. I hope this is true for him as well.
I guess it doesn’t matter, if you isolate and seize on one specific action. But it’s not just one thing, ex. clubs, it’s the sum total of his low-effort behavior. I promise we wouldn’t care about clubs and sloppy appearance if he had a 3.3-4.0 and was truthful - or if he was in clubs, volunteering and the appearance was clean cut, we’d be less judgmental about grades - or whatever mix of actions. There’s just no sign of effort or growth or appreciation…anywhere.
Indeed, a very real concern nearly everyone in the thread has ignored. While I understand universities are more than ever eager to push everyone through, there’s no guarantee he will progress to a bachelor’s. On paper, he’s certainly a high-risk to drop or be kicked out.
So. Much. This.
How do you decide the minimum hard cutoff standard? We’ve never been in this position. That really cuts to the core of what the thread is about, I suppose.
What are your son’s strengths? This has been asked a large number of times with no response from you. None.
Strengths are things you can build upon. These are more important than his shortcomings. So…what are his strengths.
[quote="J
Indeed, a very real concern nearly everyone in the thread has ignored. While I understand universities are more than ever eager to push everyone through, there’s no guarantee he will progress to a bachelor’s. On paper, he’s certainly a high-risk to drop or be kicked out.
[/quote]
You’ve gotten some great advice - and many different stances - on this thread re: cutoffs, academic standard setting, approaches to take. Funny how you seem to ignore all that. Please go back and read through the thread. You’ll find it there. I don’t read people’s posts as ignoring or dismissing the academic concerns at all. They are just expressing taking different approaches and not focusing solely on grades. You yourself have been focusing on nonacademic issues like your son’s appearance.
After 11 pages, are you no closer to coming up with some game plan on how to deal with your son?
There’s no reason with a really consistent effort and his baseline talent that a 3.0 shouldn’t be a target. 2.5 to stay. 3.0 next semester. Let him get a difficult and unrewarding summer job. It will be useful for him.
Personally I would start with the bar pretty low for this semester - just no more Ds or Fs. For Spring semester I would want to see a GPA improvement (in addition to no Ds/Fs) - 2.5 GPA minimum. Then 3.0+ from junior year on.
I would also be clear about what will happen at home if he has to take a leave from school. If it were my kid, that would be getting a job and helping pay for retake classes at the local community college.
Just to clear something up, tuition payment hasn’t changed, so I don’t think retakes cost extra money. Husband handles finances, but I believe full time is just a flat rate. Now if poor grades led to him needing summer or extra semesters, that is obviously extra - but he can’t conceptualize that far into the future, so that threat would just go in one ear out the other. It wouldn’t register or serve as any motivation.
If you are determined to substitute your judgement for his, and financial leverage for maturity, then do not make the grade the ultimatum. If he does better but gets a single D or F, you really want him to drop out? How does that improve things? If you have to go down this road, I would simply ask each semester, that the gpa for the semester be as good as, or better, than previous ones. If what you really want is for him to fail, because it confirms your accuracy of judgement and punches a hole in the martyr card, then by all means create another unrealistic expectation based on your desires and not his abilities. Said with all kindness as a mom who has been here. There will not be a do over for you. Be sure you are honest with yourself before you do anything you can’t take back.
How do you decide the minimum hard cutoff standard?
There have been many suggestions on this. From smaller incremental improvements to a “3.0 or you’re done.”
No magic formula. Set the expectations and consequences. Communicate the information. Perhaps, put it in writing so there is no confusion.
Allow him to take total ownership.
No prodding about study methods or progress reports.
Be 100% committed to the consequences. Setting the expectation is useless if you are not 100% prepared to follow through on consequences.
From your description, this could mean a couch surfing, college drop-out working at his high school service job.
But you or your husband can sit him down and walk him through the scenario so he does understand it.
I do agree with the suggestion that any parameters should not only be communicated orally but in writing as well. Something he can revisit. In fact, after talking with him, he should write his own goals, a contract of sorts, that should be read and signed by parents and child. Sounds formal but it allows for no misunderstandings, no wiggle room. I always told my kids that during their K-College years, their job was being a student. In my career, I wrote my own goals and my bosses and I went over them. Works for students, too. I did that when my kids needed a reminder about focusing.
I have not read all 211 comments, so I apologize if I’m bringing up something that was dispensed with earlier in this thread.
What is his major?
Who picked his major?
Is this major what he honestly, in his deepest heart, something wants to be majoring in? Something that he loves?
Is it possible that he isn’t very interested in his classes? But feels he has to stick to this path?
(Two of my three changed majors drastically. One realized his mistake almost immediately as a freshman, one suffered through three semesters of a major that she was capable of succeeding in, but her heart and strengths were elsewhere. She switched majors and even though her workload increased (extra classes in the new major to graduate on time) her grades went way, way up.)
Different issues are being addressed here.
-
Decision on school
Sure, spending money for a continued bad transcript with possible dismissal is probably not the best path, though he can later attend a school and the GPA starts over (with the bad transcript following him). Are there redeeming factors to his continued attendance for him (social? away from home?) and you (the latter)? What would be the plan if you asked him to leave? -
Family relationships
It seems that there are various currents in the family relationships that could be recognized and improved. It may be hard to get your son to therapy, but a first step might be for you to talk to someone. (Again many of us have done this.) Relationships are life long and a priority.
3)Your son’s “character”
Many of us have suggested getting a better picture on why your son behaves as he does, including testing (depression, ADHD, learning disability, executive function). If he had family support and private tutoring during high school his issues may have been camouflaged. Try to read (I suggested “The Myth of Laziness” and your own therapist may offer guidance.
I understand your question, and the original question is a simple one, and a very good one too. However, there are hidden messages in your posts that might point to things being a little more complicated. That is okay too.
Writing goals only works for those who are already goal-oriented. People who are unable to focus, goal-set, or manage tasks (processing disorders, executive function issues, adult adhd, etc) simply cannot be made to think this way in a sit-down come to Jesus meeting. But they’ll promise to try, and they’ll mean it. And then they’ll fail, and if you are lucky they will lie and avoid and stall to create a magic space where things can still turn out okay and you aren’t disappointed with them. But getting from A to B is like driving across the Atlantic for them.
If that is the case here in this situation, than additional work has to be done on testing, counseling, etc. You can’t just not do anything for your child if they have ADHD, some other learning disability. There’s not enough info here to go on as the OP just characterizes her son as lazy. We don’t even know the breakdown of his grades. If he got Ds or Fs in some, he must be doing okay in some others.
I have not read the entire thread just the first few pages and the last one.
I might be a little harsh here but once again I am surprised at some of the advice given.
I understand that some people “think” that once your 18 your automatically an adult. Sure by age but not my mentality. These are all “kids” trying to become adults. That’s where the parenting comes in.
He can’t just turn on a switch and boom… Become a better student. He most likely has an LD issue. Also there are kids that are addicted to gaming.
With t-mobile we can see the different usages that each person has. My son’s data was out of control. Once we talked with him it came down drastically. He knew we could check.
Secondly, I don’t let my kids self destruct! Waiting for the hopes he improves is not parenting. He evidently needs help. Get him help since he doesn’t have the coping skills to do it for himself yet.
I will get a lot of crap for what I will say next : make an appointment with learning services and the counseling center and go with him. He doesn’t have a choice. Just do it. Let them come up with a plan including tutors. This is putting him on notice. Get him evaluated for an LD /ADHD issue. Let whomever gives him strategies to become successful. If he could do it on his own he would of done it by now. He can’t and that’s just his reality. It doesn’t make him a bad person.
I just wouldn’t throw in the towel because people say he should just start to shape up. Well, he can’t without help.
At many schools that also have like intermediate colleges within them for kids that need educational help. My nephew at MSU was in this program. He did all his homework with tutors and couldn’t believe like everyone didn’t use them. Went from a"C"student to an “A” student. His parents didn’t give up on him. He just needed help.
If your student blankly refuses then maybe college is not for him. Start looking at trade schools.
Again, he won’t just magically improve on his own. He needs help like now. Get him the help he needs.
I agree.
After following all 11 pages of this thread, I’m starting to feel really sorry for the son…the lack of parental emotional support is toxic.
Op needs to read https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/1277029.You_Mean_I_m_Not_Lazy_Stupid_or_Crazy_
But get your kid help in the mean time