Note: there are several ADHD medicines, not all would have the same effects. Some non brand, generic ones are known to cause stomach upsets, which the brand form doesn’t cause. Have him investigate just in case.
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@Lemons4 we may be saying the same thing in different ways, and I may have misinterpreted. Parental detachment (much like AlAnon) really helps the situation. NAMI may be of help with that as well. Detachment may or may not involve taking the phone and car and so on. It does definitely involve letting go of anger, judgment and self-blame on the part of the parent- and living one’s life.
For me, supporting kids’ basic needs helped achieve detachment from their choices and actions. In the context of psychiatric and medical challenges (and yes ADHD). For me, practical support was detached from involvement in their decisions: no strings.
What works for one family may not work for another. What affects us all is reading about a parent- and kid- suffering. All we can do is offer our experiences which are disparate, and the OP can pick and choose what fits best.
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As @bopper notes, there are a range of reasons a kid fails at college. It is so hard to determine the reason for a particular student and to recognize that what works for one kid/situation may not work for others. For my ds with depression and ADD, the depression had to be dealt with in a medical way. We still stopped paying his rent when he was only working sporadically and not going to school. He was welcome to come home, but he didn’t want to. It took a combination of getting him to the right practitioner along with running out of money to get him onto a positive path (so far, not back at school). He is managing his meds and tells me it is because it is his choice that he is willing to stay on them and deal with the side effects.
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My brother was living with us while he was attending a technical school…I was happy to have him…but at some point he dropped out one semester (got sick and then didn’t really follow up)…at that point I said I am happy to host you while you are going to school…but if you are not going to school then I guess you are ready to go live your life…
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Not to sound like a broken record, but COVID is affecting the way I handle things. I am supporting a 29 year old who cannot safely work. She has bipolar 1, ADHD, and asthma. She has worked hard to support herself (multiple jobs while also doing two college classes). I don’t want her to get COVID.
Earlier in her late teens and twenties we had some of the same issues.
Before college, she refused Lithium and voluntarily left home so she could be “free.” This was during mania. She lived on the streets and in the woods for two months. I certainly had to “let go” though I searched for her and occasionally got to see her on the street. This was NOT tough love on my part, it was all her. I stayed steady and told her I loved her and she could come home anytime.
My image to stay steady: a parent is a tree, and the kids are squirrels, they may wander but if we stay strong and in one place, they come back.
In the fall she came back, went on meds, and has been pretty good since, working and studying and we are as close as ever. A couple of hospitalizations to adjust meds.
My career was in a homeless shelter. If you want to withdraw support entirely, it might be good to consider possible consequences if a kid really cannot function.
Like I say, our experiences affect our advice.
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ps I never ever made meds or therapy a condition for any kind of support, even when my kid was 17.
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Oh girl. You made me almost want to cry with your writing about your sweet daughter. What you are telling is a completely different story to mine. My son was perfectly capable of handling himself. He just refused to do it. He has lots of friend support and I never feared for one second that he would be on the street. So please know… anyone reading this, that I only told my story to try to uplift by explaining what worked for me.
This also happened years before Covid. You need to keep your baby with you and keep her safe.
Another big factor in our choices needs to be the child’s personality. I have 4 kids and this approach worked with him but would not have with others.
To your girl and her good mom!
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I had child who was “lazy” and if I could go back and change myself, OP, I would do it in a heartbeat.
I understand how scary it is to have a child doing poorly in life (unhappy, unsucessful in things they try, uncooperative with help and uncoordinated with problem solving). But, when I read through the thread, OP seems really angry that things have not been delivered to her. I don’t mean to seem unsympathetic; I have been there.
OP, I would think about reframing your approach. “We won’t pay for lazy” might be more successful as “Gosh, we won’t have enough to pay for school this way, let’s take a break”. " Refuse to pay for rent if he refuses to work" might be better as “if you need rent help, we need you to help us do that or move home if you can’t do that” . You’ve got to disengage your personal affront from the actual practical problem.
Your approach seems overly confrontational and directive, and might be better if you were working as a team. You seem to want to make him do things – totally understandable – but it isn’t working. Depressed, addicted, overwhelmed , ADHD – whatever the cause, ultimatums and recrimination won’t fix it. Being on his side, without trying to get what he can’t give, might.
Hang in there. Take a breath. Think about, ASK about, what you can do to help him through. Draw a line between what you want, and what you can actually do about it.Don’t make your entire lives about this. Make a plan together, stick to it, stop nagging and pushing and yet (and yet!) stay in touch. It’s a lot. A lot.
Is he safe? Self-harming? Have you gone to see him and done something neutral? You can be the lighthouse, throw a life preserver, but he is in his boat by himself and you can’t climb in. Hard stuff, parenting.
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What is OP?
OP = original poster
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I am not “really angry things have not been delivered to me”
I am sad and frustrated that my child is not happy and doesn’t seem to want to do anything about it or is unable to do much about it no matter how much I try. And blames me for his problems
“ASK about, what you can do to help him through.” I HAVE done that
He is working now - 4th day in a warehouse job he does not like at all. So I hope he sticks it out til he can start a new semester. Maybe he will realize he would rather work hard at his classes than in a warehouse job
I don’t need anything delivered to me. I want my child to reach his goals (not my goals) and do the work he needs to do to achieve those goals. And I have been there to support him and I will continue to do so. But I can’t make him do it
I don’t really appreciate that you made it look like the situation is my fault when I feel like I’ve tried to do everything that I can. But I did pour my heart out on this post and ask for suggestions, so I got some suggestions. Thank you
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OP, I don’t for one second think it is your fault. Our children are their own person – so I don’t take credit, and I don’t shoulder blame.
I think it would be healthier for you both if you concentrated on “he’s not happy” and less on “he’s lazy and won’t let me help him”. You have seemed to discard all suggestions as things you tried and didn’t work, or things you haven’t been able to make him do. If your primary concern is for his basic safety and mental health, (and of course it likely is) you might consider if your focus has stayed there, or strayed a bit. I know how easy it is to get stuck on stuff, believe me.
Don’t give up on him, and don’t stop trying to do things together that aren’t about his failures. The best coaches seem to have success with creating good moments, not just instructing about the bad ones.
Sorry to have offended, and hope he finds a path that suits him.
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Noone is saying anything is your fault, but some of us are suggesting a change in your attitude, basically to one that is a little more detached.
From the outside, not knowing you or your son, it is hard not to think there is an as yet undetermined reason for your son’s failure at school. In other words, while you seem to think very little of him for these failures, that he is not “trying,” we see the possibility that he is not ABLE to do the work for some reason that needs investigating. Noone WANTS to fail.
He seems very lost, to an outsider, and may need some time and space to get himself the testing and help that he needs. But you can’t force those things. That is the hardest part. There is nothing you can really do. In time, he may agree to some testing, especially if the idea is presented as a way to learn about his strengths and build on them.
I hope you can explain to him the practical importance of a transcript. He really should not go back to school full time until he can be assured that the grades will be better. At some point, the college would suspend or expel him anyway.
Does his school have a part-time option, through continuing education perhaps? Maybe some combination of working and classes would help. He could still live near campus and participate in social life.
It comes off that you are complaining about HIM, not the situation. If a person isn’t trying, that is concerning. It is not a character flaw, but a problem that has not been determined. In the meantime, I think it is really commendable that he found a job in his current state.
I do worry about COVID in a warehouse job and hope he is careful.
As much as you can, live your life and while paying attention to his situation, don’t make it the center of your life- as @greenbutton said.
Pick up a copy of Mel Levine’s book “The Myth of Laziness.” Here is an excerpt from a blurb about it:
“When we call someone lazy, we condemn a human being,” writes Mel Levine, M.D. In The Myth of Laziness, the bestselling author of A Mind at a Time shows that children dismissed as unproductive or “lazy” usually suffer from what he calls “output failure”—a neurodevelopmental dysfunction that can continue to cause difficulties into adulthood if left unchecked. The desire to be productive is universal, says Dr. Levine, but that drive can often be frustrated by dysfunctions that obstruct output or productivity.”
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I’m just going to put it out here that it seems to me like this OP was venting here to other parents.
I have a close friend in a similar situation with one of her Ds and what she says to me when she calls to vent is much different than what she says directly to her D.
I’m going to go out on a limb that this OP doesn’t call her son lazy and that is not the attitude that she’s taking at home.
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@momofboiler1 Thank you. You are correct. I don’t call him lazy and I don’t think he is lazy. And I didn’t even say anywhere here that he is lazy except that he was lazy in high school — he could do all the work with minimal effort and still get great grades
But he is not lazy. He is stuck. And confused and doesn’t know how to fix it so he is frustrated and hopeless. But he is also stubborn and defiant
I think very slowly he is realizing that this is his battle/problem and it is his own. It is not with me.
He does need time to figure out what he wants and then do the things necessary to achieve it. And I will be there supporting him every step of the way
In the meantime, it’s just hard to watch and I hate when we have a bad relationship
But tonite I’m bringing dinner to both my kids and I how we can sit together and eat and have a nice experience
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And I really really think psychological testing could help. He might get a diagnosis and then could take the right steps (medicine, therapy) to treat the diagnosis. Hopefully he will go to the testing someday.
Otherwise, he just thinks things will get better on their own. Maybe they will but they haven’t yet
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Sending lots of cyber hugs your way OP and I hope you can have a lovely meal with your kids tonight!
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Levine’s book isn’t just about laziness. The idea is that there is a natural drive for productivity and obstacles to that need to be uncovered.
Sounds like things are moving in the right direction. @9101transfermum. Loved that last post. Have a nice dinner with your kids!
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Op I get it. You’ve tried but your wallet can’t take him failing anymore. It is okay to say no to your children. You do not need to pay for any more of his schooling right now if you don’t think he’s in a successful mindset.
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OP you are spot on, IMO.
From your posts, it sounds like your son is struggling with something serious and is attempting to cope and hope that it turns out well. And of course it probably won’t if things continue as they are, and that’s scary and upsetting to him. He’s grasping at any reason (in his mind) for these “failures” by accusing you of not treating him fairly/favoring his sister, etc (things are harder for me because/if only they had done this for me things would be different because, etc . . ). A lot of this is just plain old lack of personal insight into symptoms and some of it’s understandable denial as well, because the alternative explanation of a serious mental illness is quite frightening.
Friends of ours in a similar situation finally discovered that their son of a similar age as yours was suffering from schizophrenia. Unfortunately it was very difficult to arrive at that diagnosis - even under outpatient therapy for addiction and other issues - and took a couple of years, including a year at home and a psychotic break. Please note that each illness of this type is unique to the individual; that’s in part why it can be so difficult to diagnose.
If your son ends up facing a similarly serious illness, it’s not going to be about just getting medication and getting back on track. It’s not even going to be about getting back to school necessarily. It’ll be about helping him learn to live as full a life as possible with mental illness, whatever path that might take. Your job will be to accompany him in his journey and get educated in how to help him and how to do self care (including getting support yourself).
I would take the advice of others who are recommending a re-thinking of the situation. It’s not possible to devote resources to support his living independently, especially if he doesn’t keep that job he just started (if he does, indeed, keep it - different story, but I would not expect it). I would try to get him home by removing any support that allows him to live elsewhere. This doesn’t have to be phrased punitively; it’s simply a matter of family resources; the funds have to be preserved for further education/enrichment (I would not be thinking of returning to college at this point). He needs to be home and under the close eye of psychiatric experts. If a screening rules out all but personal foibles and an attitude problem, that will be joyful news because a bit of growth and maturity will turn that around, whether it be finishing college, or choosing another path. But if it’s something beyond his genuine ability to manage on his own, you need to be there to help him navigate this, even if he’s not open to the idea at this point.
Invite him home, and gently invite him to reach out for professional help, do a bit of exploring into what’s going on. Remove obstacles, go with him if he wants you to, and let him know how much you care about him and his happiness (not his success or his ability to finish his degree or hold down a job). Again, he’s suffering from a lack of insight - some of that is due to his attempting to cope and pretend that everything’s all right, and some of it is completely unintentional. Let him know he is loved and that you are there to help him live his life to the fullest. Then walk that journey with him for as long as is necessary.
Best of luck to you both!
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