I am frantic

<p>and it is not "punishment" it is a renegotiation of financials seeing that the adult college students seems to have money to burn....how is that punishment?</p>

<p>Treading lightly? Actually I think it is an adult way to treat someone to listen to them so they will talk.</p>

<p>If someone has serious problems, you have to listen calmly so they'll talk about things and not just lie or evade. That's true of all people, kid or adult. Shrillness just doesn;t get you anywhere with people. Accusations make people defensive. This is pretty basic stuff in human communication, no?</p>

<p>By treading lightly I was not addressing how the subject was approached. I was addressing those that seem to believe all college kids behave badly and a parent funding them doesn't have a right to condition the funding on reasonable behavior. If I had a dollar for every parent I know who wishes they had not been pushovers at early signs of disturbing behavior, I'd be one rich broad.</p>

<p>I feel cynical tonight. I can't help wondering why "Mom<em>Needs</em>Help"---who claims she's warned her children against putting personal information on the internet... would have her first post in a public forum be loaded with personal information. And then not come back and post any additional information....</p>

<p>Is it possible some student is yanking our collective chain?</p>

<p>As I said... I am feeling cynical.</p>

<p>dmd77 -
I had that same thought...</p>

<p>Might not be first post. Could be a regular with a different name. </p>

<p>Or could be a student yanking our chains. I don't necessarily think that, but it could be.</p>

<p>My chain is very easily yanked. I have had my kids do things similar to what nikrud describes (post #37), not raunchy stuff, but stuff that got me sweating and then "just kidding" -- ha ha, very funny.</p>

<p>Wow, everyone's jumping to some major conclusions here. Remember what happens when we ASS-U-ME.</p>

<p>Essentially, here's what I gathered from the OP's post.</p>

<ul>
<li><p>S is drinking in school and has been disciplined by the school for that. This could range anywhere from an RA walking into his room and seeing a shot glass and writing him up to him being completely black out every night and destroying things/honestly causing concern among his peers. Since he wasn't suspended or expelled (obviously, since the OP would know) and his grades are still good, I wouldn't call him a raging alcoholic just yet. Generally, GENERALLY constantly binge drinking to the point of alcoholism takes some sort of toll on the rest of your life. Also consider that at many schools, students can be disciplined for alcohol violations even if they're just nursing a beer at a frat party.</p></li>
<li><p>S is gambling, online and possibly otherwise. Again, this doesn't tell us much. I have a weekly poker game with a few of my friends. Do I consider myself a chronic gambler in need of counseling? No. Many college students play online poker often. Do all of them need professional help? No, probably not. Most likely, the OP's S hasn't racked up thousands of dollars in gambling debts, since he'd probably have to come to his parents to pay those debts. So it depends very much on the severity of the gambling - putting $20 on PartyPoker, while some might find it reprehensible, is not an enormous crisis. Gambling every day, winning or losing, to the point where it takes a toll on other aspects of your life, very well could be. Which is it.</p></li>
<li><p>S is engaging in "highly innappropriate sexual behavior". What does this mean? Depending on the viewer, this could range from having sex with a long term girlfriend to slipping roofies into drunken girls' drinks, raping them, and leaving them in back alleys. (And I would hope, of course, that it's not the latter). Regardless, I don't think it's any of the OPs business who her S is having sex with as long as he's not actively harming anyone/forcing someone to do something against their will. Yes, he posted the information on a public forum, which made the information public. Her acting on this information (at least as it pertains to sex) would be extremely controlling for the parent of the college student IMHO. His sexual decisions are just that - HIS.</p></li>
<li><p>S is unhappy at his school/considering transferring. Again consider that most people see blogging as sort of a "venting" place, where they can get their feelings out. Generally, I only write in mine when I'm sad or lonely or depressed, because it's therapeutic for me. If someone were to read my blog, they'd probably think I was in need of some Prozac and fast. That's not true, I'm a happy person, but writing is my form of coping. We've all had thoughts of transferring, been unhappy with some aspect of our school - if S really wants to act on his feelings, he will most certainly come to the OP at some point.</p></li>
<li><p>S is "disregarding family values." In this, all I can say is that perhaps, S's values are different from yours. By 19, we have all had at least a little life experience and most of us can determine many of the things we consider fundamentally wrong. OP may just have to deal with the fact that S has a different value system than her own.</p></li>
<li><p>S is posting sensitive information on a public forum. Now if this information popped up in a general Google search of his name (who writes a blog under their real name anyway?) then I'd pop open the window and show it to S and mention that anyone - employers, relatives, anybody - has access. If it's the result of snooping from a myspace to a facebook to a random comment on a page to a link to a blog - maybe it's not as public as you think it is.</p></li>
</ul>

<p>I think that if the problems discussed in the blog are SERIOUS problems, one your S might need counseling or professional help in dealing with, you should absolutely approach him. Gently, not in a threatening manner, but in an honest desire to help him. Otherwise - leave well enough alone. He's in college, drinking and partying. Lot worse things he could be doing.</p>

<p>"If it's the result of snooping from a myspace to a facebook to a random comment on a page to a link to a blog - maybe it's not as public as you think it is."</p>

<p>All of those things are very public. I literally accidentally found older S's blog, which he had written under an assumed name on My Space or a similar place. I was not looking for his blog. He had e-mailed me some compliments people had posted about his music, and I had e-mailed him back asking where they had posted. When he didn't answer, I plugged the comments into Google and up came his blog. </p>

<p>I know someone who lost their job due to statements that the person had made on My Space that clearly indicated the person hated their job. Their boss never told the person that the boss had seen the page. The person still probably thinks they were laid off due to a funds shortage,but truth is, they were laid off because their boss saw their negative comments about their job (and it also was clear that the person was blogging during work time).</p>

<p>As for the thought that it's normal and OK for students to be "partying" in college. I don't think that such behavior is OK. When I worked in a college counseling center, I had a client who at about age 19 was having alcohol-related blackouts (meaning she couldn't remember what she had done when she was drinking). That is one major sign of alcoholism. </p>

<p>When I was in college, one of my friends from high school started drinking heavily in college -- drinking enough to pass out and was date raped.</p>

<p>There are serious problems that can occur due to heavy drinking. Those problems range from developing alcoholism to being in alcohol related accidents (Many students who fall from balconies during spring break or are hit by cars while walking are drunk) to being raped or charged with rape.</p>

<p>When it comes to learning that one's offspring may be doing things that are life threatening, I don't think parents should sit on their hands and say, "Boys (or young men) will be boys." Too much is at risk. At the very least, the parent should have a talk with their student. To me, the worst thing that could happen would be that the parent does nothing and then something awful happens. The parent would always wonder if that event would have happened if the parent had spoken up.</p>

<p>I am speaking as a parent who has been in a very similar situation to the OP. I told my husband what I found. We both talked to a family therapist. Husband, younger S and I wrote a letter to older S letting him know that we loved him, and letting him know that we had seen his blog. We got We also offered to pay for treatment.</p>

<p>S turned down our offer, but at least we know that we have done everything that we can.</p>

<p>As for the OP, her post seems very believable to me. I also wouldn't be surprised if the OP is a regular who is posting under an assumed name so as not to have her S be identified. The situation is a difficult and painful one, and I can very well imagine that the OP may have felt more comfortable sharing it on a message board than with friends or relatives who might spread gossip or even blame her.</p>

<p>dmd--given that the situation could be anything described by luckycharm, I do not think there is anything particularly revealing or personal in the OP's post. "Highly inappropriate" behavior could mean anything from seeing a woman unveiled to homosexuality to rape and pillage--it all depends on your definition of what is "appropriate" sexual behavior. We simply have no data about what is going on with this student, and that's why the posts advising the OP to react strongly are, in my opinion, not helpful.</p>

<p>Now everyone hold up just a second and hit the reset button, this is getting a bit out of hand. Point by point.
1) Drinking excessively. His grades are still high, so he's still apparently able to lead a normal life. How much is "excessively?" Going to parties and getting drunk on the weekends is normal for college students. Drinking during the week may indicate a problem. What are you dealing with here.</p>

<p>2) Gambling. To those saying "every dollar spent gambling can be spend on r/b" why is the assumption being made that he is losing money? Playing poker online MANY people make money. I make money (though I never play anything higher than 5 cent hands so not much), I have friends who's main source of income is online poker. If it is not effecting his normal life (coursework, interpersonal relationships), he is not losing money, and he is not addicted to it, what is the problem? Say he loads $50 onto the site, plays around with it, stays around $50, how's that any different from just playing a video game?</p>

<p>3) Highly inappropriate sex - We need a definition here too. This could be anything from unprotected multiple partners to simply having sex with his girlfriend, depending on what YOU call inapproptriate. Sex happens at college, and thats something you can either deal with or ignore, but it happens. The ONLY reason that I can think of that you would EVER have occasion to step in is if it was unprotected. Pick your battles and do not pick this one.</p>

<p>4) Sounding unhappy/lonely - Everyone goes through "down times," especially at college and especially when midterms or finals roll around. Just be there for him, you can ask if he's feeling down about anything. If you DO tell him you were reading the blog (whether you do or not is dependant on some of the clarifications above) you can ask him why he wants to transfer.</p>

<p>Now, post in this thread again. This is interesting. :)</p>

<p>edit: Also, no drugs were ever mentioned, not sure where that came from.</p>

<p>I'm with Northstarmom -- people should assume that what they post on the internet is public. If mom can find it so can other people. Not to mention that people (friends of friends) cut and paste my space and blogs and e-mail <em>interesting</em> stuff to others. Once it is out there, you cannot control who sees it. If the kid is posting things that could come back and bite him, someone should tell him. If it were my kid, I would.</p>

<p>to me its about $$....I would not want to put in $$ while he is spending money partying....if he is mature enough to make that decision, the he is mature to take HIS socalled $$ and put it into the kitty for his schooling</p>

<p>what, mom should pay for everything so son can play alot?</p>

<p>don't tink so</p>

<p>and that is not a moral judgement, it is a practicle one</p>

<p>for instance, if mom is helping pay off childs loans, and she sees child in a bunch of new clothes, is it smart for mom to keep paying the same amount</p>

<p>nope</p>

<p>and chuy, if he has enough $$ to gamble, why isn't he paying more for his own education, and if he is winning he is one selfish man for not helping family take care of his education</p>

<p>and please, most people lose gambling, those that claim to win are liars</p>

<p>How do we know that he is spending her money partying? I'm just saying that we don't have all of the facts here. He could have money saved from summer jobs, or could even have a job now. Partying is not expensive ($3 will get you a cup at most parties, some are free) so that money angle might not be the best way to go. I just feel like we're judging the kid based off of one post which is a second hand account of his blog from his mom that leaves out what could be important information. His mom is paying the money for him to get an education, and since his grades are high he appears to be doing this. IF he is using his own money for partying or whatever, and he is using his mothers money in the way she intended (education), and his habits are not self destructive (controlled gambling and drinking are not self destructive, and neither is safer sex) what is the problem?</p>

<p>"and chuy, if he has enough $$ to gamble, why isn't he paying more for his own education, and if he is winning he is one selfish man for not helping family take care of his education"</p>

<p>I put $50 in a poker site about a year ago. I don't play THAT often but I've never put any more money in, and rarely any money out. Maybe $100 total, ever. Without looking I'm around $45 right now. That's about a third of a credit hour that I've spent and it's kept me entertained more than most other video games or a couple movies would.</p>

<p>"and please, most people lose gambling, those that claim to win are liars"</p>

<p>In poker somebody has to win, and if you're good and play low stakes you stand a good chance of winning or breaking even in the long run. Poker is not purely a game of chance where there is a house advantage, if you're better at it than the other people then you will, in the long run, beat them.</p>

<p>Anyone find it odd that the OP posted nearly 24 hours ago asking for help and has not returned?</p>

<p>Who knows. Maybe Frantic is embarassed that she posted this situation on the internet. Maybe she told her husband and is dealing with that. Could be a lot of reasons. That's the thing with the interenet. Nobody knows the whole story!</p>

<p>
[quote]
Drinking excessively (even getting in trouble at school for it),

[/quote]
</p>

<p>The "getting into trouble" and not mentioning it to parents is certainly a cause of concern. What trouble? Disciplinary issues? Being told off by RA?
It seems there's a lack of communication with family was well.</p>

<p>
[quote]
gambling on line, highly inappropriate sexual behavior,

[/quote]

Without further detail, one cannot know what kind of sexual behavior is being deemed inappropriate. As for gambling online, how frequently, for how much?</p>

<p>
[quote]
and he sounds (at times anyway) very unhappy and lonely. He even writes about transferring to our state U - and I have NEVER heard that he is unhappy at his school. (His grades are pretty good.)

[/quote]

Again, this belies a real lack of communication with parents. Either that, or self-dramatization. If he is serious about transferring, he would need to discuss it with parents, not spring it on them.</p>

<p>
[quote]
He is a very nice kid from a very strong family. He knows our values, but seems to have disregarded them entirely.

[/quote]

This is not surprising. That's what going to college, experimenting, learning to be your own person is about. </p>

<p>
[quote]
How far can I push a 19 soon-to-be 20 year old? I am seriously upset enough that I am considering not paying his tuition bill.

[/quote]
</p>

<p>He is earning "pretty good grades." He is not slacking off (and to those who say "pretty good grades" are a sign he is not applying himself sufficiently, no parents have a right to demand stellar grades of their kids. "Pretty good grades" sound pretty good to me). There is no cause to refuse to pay tuition bill</p>

<p>
[quote]
Some other thoughts might be to demand that he move into a quiet/substance free dorm hoping he'll make different friends.

[/quote]
He's already made friends. He might make new ones, but he won't abandon old ones. Social life is not confined to one's dorm, so this strikes me as an exercise in futility.</p>

<p>
[quote]
Should I demand to see exactly what he's been spending his money on? (And it is his money, not mine - except for his tuition and room and board, a big "except" of course.)

[/quote]
It's his money; you have no right.</p>

<p>So: it comes down with having a real talk with your son, not to lay down the law, threaten to withhold tuition, demand to vet how his spend his time and money. But to find out more about his feelings of loneliness, his desire to transfer; to remind him about the dangers of gambling addiction, binge drinking and inappropriate sexual behavior (which to me would mean chiefly unprotected sex, coerced sex and sexual harassment); to give him support if indeed he is unhappy where he is and discuss the possibility of transferring if he truly wants it.</p>

<p>
[quote]
It's his money; you have no right.

[/quote]

I have to disagree with this one. He only has "his" money because Mom's paying for everything else. If he were using "his" money to support himself, Mom would have no right. Otherwise, I think she has every right, or at least the right to reduce her contribution to his upkeep by the amount of "his" money.</p>

<p>Even though he may be working, I think it's ludicrous to consider that a student, supported by his parents, has anything even resembling "his own" money.</p>

<p>Chedva:</p>

<p>The only reason that the OP is considering demanding an account of how he is spending his money is that she disapproves of how he is spending it. She is also so disapproving that she is considering withholding his tuition. </p>

<p>It's okay to voice concern about how a student is spending his money and give advice on whether it's the best possible use. I did that when S talked about going on some rather expensive trip in order to participate in some event. I suggested he might be better off looking into similar events that were close to home and would not cost so much. But I made it clear I was not vetoing th trip. He agreed with me and dropped the idea.
It's different from demanding veto power over it. In that case, it's no longer his money. It also robs him of the incentive to go out and earn it and learn how to budget it if mom can confiscate it or dictate how he may spend it.</p>