<p>Interesting, cbug. And what did he say was the reason he never bothered to call them back? Was he too anxious/embarrassed? I’d want to know if he isn’t being responsible because, like wawa, he just doens’t think it’s that important, or if he has anxiety issues that prevent him from following through.<br>
As the picture is rounding out, I think professional evaluation would be my first step. If getting through college is this much of a challenge, he’ll need to find some ways of managing his time and coping with any anxiety issues in order to handle life after college.</p>
<p>I don’t have any new advice but wanted to wish cbug the best in a trying situation.</p>
<p>“He was so wrapped up in one particular ED that was demanding 20-30 hours per week that he didn’t show up for some shifts.”</p>
<p>cbug, maybe he will learn the consequences of not getting his priorities straight by himself- I sure hope so for his sake- but someone who spends THAT much time on a outside activity while in college may have either an inability to plan realistically or judge how long things will actually take him to complete- a hallmark of executive function disorder- or he has lost focus on what is really important-his ability to graduate.
Either way, it is jeopardizing his future .</p>
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I’m sorry, but this is a very suspicious-sounding excuse. Somebody just not showing up for work is really, really suggestive of a drinking or substance abuse problem. I know you said you don’t believe that’s it, but…</p>
<p>^ Nope, still don’t buy it. I don’t want to give anymore details, but this particular EC was all consuming, forcing him to be a highly visible figure on campus for 6 straight weeks. Absolutely no way he could have pulled it off by drinking or abusing drugs. Nor participate in 5 other ECs. He was getting scheduled at work during the time he was also committed to the EC. He got overwhelmed – plain and simple.</p>
<p>It wasn’t fraternity rush, was it?</p>
<p>I, too, wish you the best. I have kids who have not yet been able to get it together. It took my one brother more time than we’d wanted to do the same. Sadly, some people do not ever get on track, so one hopes and prays that this is not the case with our young adults.</p>
<p>People often say things like “sink or swim” or “having to hit rock bottom”, but the reality is that as parents we don’t want have our kids be a slab in the morgue, and it’s a reality that happens to some our children. I’ve known too many cases where it happened. So I don’t want my kids to drown, and so, yes, I reluctantly have fished them out of some messes. But some water up their noses, and discomfort along with swimming lessons is the deal, rather than a subsidized life jacket. You do have to play it by ear, as each case, each person has its own story, it’s own issues. Taking pat advice is not the way to go. You have to tailor it to your child and your own limitations as well. </p>
<p>Good luck. I’m there too, with older kids, and am hoping mine become more independent and responsible.</p>
<p>^^ No, Hunt, it wasn’t.</p>
<p>Sometimes telling a person/your kid the absolute truth is helpful. </p>
<p>“I am totally confused about what’s happened to you. I don’t know to what degree or how I can help or if you’re an adult and should fix this yourself. I’ve talked to my friends. Some say drugs, some say depression, some say ADHD. What is it?”</p>
<p>By spelling out some of the (bad) possibilities you get a really honest response. And you’ve maybe said the bad word first which relieves the pressure on them.</p>
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<p>If you really believe this is the case - and I have no reason to doubt it - what do you want him to do? Obviously, he can’t participate in all these activities AND go to classes AND have a job. Someone has to guide him into prioritizing his life goals and then lead him through an exercise how he is meeting those goals.</p>
<p>Tempemom-that’s perfect-even if the kid says, “I don’t know, but it’s not A,B, or X,” you have something to go on, like he may be sure it’s NOT ADD but can’t get organized, or he may prove it’s not drinking, but can’t seem to wake up, etc. So many issues manifest in the late teens and early 20’s. It still sounds so much like friends’ depression, but OP needs to talk to the son in person if at all possible and work with him to get to the bottom of this.</p>
<p>A highly functioning person with a clinical depression can certainly be a supastar in extra curricular’s while failing a class and missing the rent. He should be evaluated for bipolar (sounds like he might be on a manic phase which if so makes all the EC work do-able but nope you still won’t be able to do the regular stuff like get up and go to work and pay the rent). The walking away from a job is the troubling part.</p>
<p>wawa - come on now, forgetting to sending a thank you card is not more important than not sending the rent off on time.</p>
<p>Mmmh that’s interesting, I’m very surprised that so many people disagree with me (as in I wonder why my sense of priorities and responsibility is by consensus flawed). It always seemed to me that spending mental and emotional energy on things like answering professional and academic contacts politely and promptly at all time, writing thank you notes to people who I might potentially be asking for recommendations, or internships and jobs, were completely and unquestionably more important than staying on top of things like rent, work-study, etc… Just like I never hesitate to spend money I don’t have to pay for something like needed nice interview outfit or nice meals and energy snacks during finals week, even if the money was meant to pay a bill. I would never hesitate to skip a work shift to finish a problem set on time. Maybe it is undesirable. I’m not sure how people manage to do it all though.</p>
<p>Wawa, I know you’re going to think I’m 100 years old… but I borrowed an interview suit from a friend senior year of college. And then borrowed the suit again (but bought my own blouse) for callbacks. I did not have the money (like you, it was meant to pay the bills) so I somehow managed to land a job in someone else’s clothing.</p>
<p>That is how it was done “back in the day”. And skipping a work shift- when it meant that your boss and colleagues were going to have to either work overtime or handle double the stress in order to cover you- was for when you got the flu, not for when you needed to finish a problem set on time.</p>
<p>I respect that times have changed. But you need to realize that in many cases, the folks who make decisions about your future (med school admissions committees; hiring managers for companies; etc.) are usually closer to my generation than yours. And once you are graduated from college, there is an expectation that you will have figured out how to juggle multiple priorities (job, fun, schoolwork, balancing your checkbook and paying your taxes) simultaneously.</p>
<p>You sound like a talented and fun kid- best of luck to you.</p>
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<p>Actually, I’m not sure times have changed all that much with respect to meeting work obligations. ATM, I know two recent graduates (one 23 and one 24) who have been fortunate enough to be working at good jobs in professional careers and I don’t think that either of them would be particularly tolerant of someone not coming to work unless there was a compelling reason (ie, the flu, not a hangover). One in particular is in her first management job working 60+ hours per week and she has said repeatedly that she doesn’t have any sympathy for her co-workers or subordinates who don’t take their jobs as seriously as she does. I suspect she may mellow somewhat eventually but as a recent college grad, she doesn’t seem to reflect the notions expressed by Wawa. </p>
<p>It’s likely that guys in their early 20’s take longer to get their work priorities straight than this young lady has but I know that she had some serious partying experience as an undergrad and that hasn’t seemed to lessen her work ethic or expectations of those she works with. It may be that those with Wawa’s more relaxed attitude toward meeting adult expectations may be in for a rude awakening post graduation, even if they aren’t dealing with much older superiors.</p>
<p>Wawa, I understand where you are coming from. I believe that both times I posted here I said I thought that several of these circumstances fit in the “normal” range, but that the overall picture, since it is sudden and different from past patterns, might suggest something to look into. Perhaps mainly the hubbub or anxiety of fall of senior year, who knows.</p>
<p>I think the parent probably knows instinctively how much of this is truly a concern and what to do about it, ultimately.</p>
<p>Just this week a very responsible young man I know failed to call an employer, another slept until 6, and I am surprised every month my daughter remembers to pay bills (her first apartment). One of my kids has health issues and forgot to get meds during the crunch of thesis-with consequences far more serious than anything described here. This kid is very responsible overall.</p>
<p>That said, this son has had depression and this is a change for him and the parent is concerned. I think it is perhaps, at least I hope, comforting to know that some of us don’t think these omissions are that awful, but I also wouldn’t want to invalidate a parent for genuine concern that is based on things only a parent knows.</p>
<p>Wawa, I agree that mistakes are made in a lot of the areas you mention, as young adults sometimes slowly grow up. What should be happening as you mature, however, is an increasing awareness that those things are important in life. That you might need references from your prior jobs, that your credit history might have some of these missed payments, and also that the world might a lot smaller than you may think. </p>
<p>Most important of all, however, is that getting a grasp of these things, often means focusing on them. Like the soon to become addict who swears he’s not addicted, when it becomes apparent that one hasn’t been able to get into the swing of these things, it’s often too late to do so without a lot of pain and cost. I’ve seen it happen, time after time. My peers who did not get on track on those commitments have suffered mightily from those habits of carelessness and attitude.</p>
<p>Wawa- because you signed a contract to pay your rent on a certain date every month, not doing so reflects on someone’s integrity. A contract is a promise, and the person who you’re renting from has bills to pay and is counting on that income. Not coming into work, whether it’s work study or an outside job, inconveniences others and may even mean lost income for the employer.
A person with maturity and integrity doesn’t do something that benefits only themselves (like studying for a test or prepping for an interview) at the expense of their obligations to others. It’s sort of like breaking a promise when it’s just not convenient to keep it.
Life gets harder after college, not easier. If you can’t manage your time because you have too much on your plate, you can correct that.
You may have to give up social time, sleep, or just accept a lower grade sometimes. That’s the way it works in real life.</p>
<p>Oh, I think I understand better what is the problem now. I was assuming that everything gets easier after college, when one has more money and time, and less worries, but actually you are right those are skills to pick up now because it doesn’t. Might even be worse when one has a real job and maybe even children, I can’t imagine. It’s interesting, I guess my mom’s job, staying on top of the entire family’s affairs, was much harder than it looked/looks. And I guess it’s not something one learns overnight after graduation if they never tried to deal with those things responsibly before. Never thought of it like that.</p>
<p>Lots of schools do know how flaky we can be about work. At my school there is always a sub-list for shifts so if I can’t make it, I text a friend to please pick up my shift, or just e-mail the entire sub-list and someone will pick up the shift within seconds. Nobody is missing me (we do emails but lots of school use scheduling software like whentowork, kronos, zoomshift, etc… which makes it even easier). I got fired from the 1st job because my parents said I’d now pay for cell phone plan my freshman year, which I didn’t want to do so I chose not to have a phone for a year (which was annoying) so I couldn’t always contact subs timely unless I had my heavy PC with me. To me the best verbal analogy for a lease isn’t a promise but a conditional clause. If we don’t pay on time we get charged a late fee, which incidentally only represents less than a 1.5% increase on the rent and seems worth the financial freedom. </p>
<p>Anyways, it was sort of a digression, best of luck to the OP. It does seem that older adults and us read two different stories out of the same book, and before concluding that it must be a clinical problem, which it might very well be indeed, maybe it’s worth checking if some of it isn’t just understanding things differently. Most of the things described in the original post do sound like things all my friends and I have done, though I guess maybe we wouldn’t do all of them at once, and most of us have very clear professional plans which helps turning this extremely overwhelming time of our lives into something exciting and inspiring. That’s why I was thinking that maybe the main problem is the OP’s son finding a realistic yet engaging career path to hang on to. College kids do very many things that would seem absolutely crazy to their parents, and perhaps what the OP is describing sounds peculiar to many, but that’s probably because most of us wouldn’t share this information with anyone except our peers.
Anyways thank you, you guys do have a point as well, hopefully I can learn to be less dismissive about all that intimidating finance and scheduling stuff before I finish college.</p>
<p>I do think that college, particularly senior year, can be very distracting and because the schedule and demands are not consistent, the way many 9-5 or 7-3 jobs are, it is harder to be organized. Even sleep and eating schedules are inconsistent from day to day. Add to that mix anything else that can tip the balance, like ill health, ADHD, anxiety about the future, and forgetting things is understandable, to a point. I have seen kids who suffer from disorganization pull it together once out, and others who don’t. I trust the parent’s concerns but also think, Wawa, that you have added a useful perspective from a peer.</p>