<p>From what I have read, [which included ONLY the first page of this thread, so I apologize if the following advise is now outdated], plus having been through the NORMAL experience of having a college freshman pull away from parental control during the first extended visit home, which IS to be expected during the freshman year in college, I'd say you're stuck between a depressed, resentful Dad who is reliving his own experience with his parents, and a child who is rightfully trying to establish her own independence. I agree with others who suggest counseling now for your hubby. He has most probably suppressed bad feeling and memories from his own past, and now they are bubbling up to the surface because of all the stress he is going through AND ALL THE FACTORS HE NOW REALIZES IS UNABLE TO CONTROL- namely growing older, and the realization that he is also losing control over his child.</p>
<p>The problem I would have is that my H would NEVER get counseling How does our H feel about that fannypack?</p>
<p>All this talk about counseling is probably being countered or will be countered by the husband by the thought of paying for it. However, it is him that needs the counseling or he risks literally throwing your daughter to this boy permanently. She is being hugely responsible for what I can see and you cannot stop a relationship between people -- 18 or 16 as far as I have ever been able to tell. My parents never said one word about any guy I ever dated - ever. There was only one time when I was about 18 I dated a guy about 24 over the summer. I knew my parents were nervous and I could also see how hard they were trying to not freak out. I had to give them credit. Your husband sounds very defensive and to be frank, very insecure. Your daughter is being defensive because.. well, her life and friends are questions and she feels she needs to defend them.</p>
<p>He needs some counseling to understand why he is wanting to hold on so tight (which only is pushing her further away). How he gets that is probably more dependent on the community you live in and the resources available. But if he truly cares about his daughter he will try to relax and trust that you have instilled in her respectful values. No, it's not easy, but assuming her every move is dishonorable is really harsh.</p>
<p>Lauren, I've seen many a husband seek counseling who claimed he never would when his loved ones tell him that relationships are in jeopardy. It's often quite hard for the wife, or the husband when the shoe is on the other foot, but many wake up one morning and realize they can't keep allowing their spouse to cause these deep family problems.</p>
<p>OP, please teach me how to loose 8 lb in the winter break!!! I probably gained more than 8 lb from all those drinking while DD was back home. Things she did... ... well... ... that would a whole page of stories</p>
<p>I did not read all the post except the first couple. I think there are three facts that you and your H must admit: 1) your DD is a smart and capable person as she got a 4.0 in college; 2) you are doing much better than most of middle class families financially as you could afford 1/2 tuition and others expenses for a private college; and 3) you both know you will not cut the funding for her college.</p>
<p>So, either your DH gets along with DD and enjoy their time together as a family or get himself upset for nothing. He has to realize that DD is smart enough to take care of herself and there is nothing he could do to change her now. Say things when you are really going to do it, otherwise all the words just hurting feelings. What if your DD gone to a school that were 3000 miles away? You would have not control over her activities whatsoever. </p>
<p>I, for one, vote against counselling. It is a waste of money. It is all about words and does not change any facts. </p>
<p>This is the time our children learning to expand their wings. Trying to stop them will only get both hurt. I have made peace with myself that "just let it go". </p>
<p>Best of luck to you and yours.</p>
<p>Okay, it must be my turn to bite into what Dad II has offered this time. A recommendation AGAINST counseling from a man who was driven to drink by his "DD" over the holidays? Is that how you "made peace with yourself" and "just let it go"? Hmmmm....</p>
<p>fannypack, I can't offer any additional advice -- the parents here are pretty amazing with help when you have a problem to share. I can only say come on over whenever you like - you DO have friends here! A big cyber <strong><em>hug</em></strong> to you from me.</p>
<p>
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I, for one, vote against counselling. It is a waste of money. It is all about words and does not change any facts.
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</p>
<p>Men.. sheesh <wink> This is EXACTLY what my husband would say. However, he also loves our daughters to the moon and back and would slay a dragon for them if it came to it. He loves me too, but I might end up crispy bacon instead. Point is, he might be willing to do this if it was made clear he was not looking out for her best interests and instead was bullying her.</wink></p>
<p>Thing is... A lot of this has nothing to do with facts and that's why understanding the underlying feelings and insecurities are often times just as important to letting it go as building peace in your life. </p>
<p>Now Dad ..just because the F word came up (feelings) dont go screaming from the room :)</p>
<p>family counseling is definitely in order here. Also your D's school no doubt makes counseling available to students; you should encourage your D to take advantage of it, she is in quite a predicament and could use a neutral and independent person to talk with. </p>
<p>Lastly, and I'll bring this up because nobody else seems to want to touch this with a 10 foot pole -- make sure your D is on the pill. You wrote
[quote]
He took issue with her asking if the bf could stay overnight at our house New Years Eve (there was no way for him to get back home that late), because she wouldn't explicitly state there would be no "hanky-panky" as he called it.
[/quote]
I'm not being judgemental or saying its right or wrong, but it pretty clearly is. The last thing she needs is some statement of defiance or independence she may later come to regret.</p>
<p>"I, for one, vote against counselling. It is a waste of money."</p>
<p>Only for SOME people!</p>
<p>I think most everyone here has offered useful advice, but all of it, particularly the idea of counseling, will take time and effort to get rolling and more time and effort to get results. Right now, you have a short-term problem--another school vacation is coming up quite soon. Is it possible for your daughter to spend part of her break at the home of a school friend, at her boyfriend's home, in the dorm, or away even at a volunteer project? Another period at home will only be a replay of the same conflicts between father and daughter and lead to further deterioration in their relationship. With your daughter at a school so nearby, it seems you can see her whenever you want anyway, so not having her at home for the whole break wouldn't be terribly difficult for you and, in fact, would relieve you from your role as referee.</p>
<p>I had a difficult relationship with my parents, and often chose to spend my school vacations elsewhere for my own well being. I'd touch base at home, but only stay a short time in order to avoid getting entangled in the same old drama. I think it was a good choice for all of us.</p>
<p>It is all about words and does not change any facts.</p>
<p>Would DadII even know what * facts are*?;)</p>
<p>Typically- since the first step is even recognizing there is a concern worth getting help for, the people * most* in need of an experienced counselor, are the least likely to see it.</p>
<p>I am kind of going through the same stuff, but I'm a guy who is fighting with his mom. From my perspective, I have always been a pretty independent guy. I hate when people yell at me or tell me what to do. When my mom yells at me I just try to ignore her and do my own thing, but this irritates her even more. I understand that she cares about me, but as a teenager I need my own space. Personally, I would hate counseling. Being a little obstinate, I don't like listening to the advise of others when they don't know what is going on and how I feel. I think your H's and D's personalities are clashing. My mom is a very uptight, energetic, perfectionist, while I am more reserved, laid back kind of guy. I know that we will never "click", so in order to preserve our relationship, we usually spend time away from each other. I think your daughter should just try to release all her frustration for now and when she is ready she will happily come back. Go do family activities together, talk about things she is interested in. I know I get really upset whenever my mom mentions school because that is what she always talks about.
If all else fails, I guess do counseling, but for many people it just doesn't work.</p>
<p>In the past four pages of posts, there’s one suggestion I haven’t seen. I have two daughters. The oldest is an Ivy Junior & the youngest is a H.S. senior. They’re both amazing kids with good heads on their shoulders. The older one has always been amenable to suggestions. The youngest… loves to argue with & critique me. (This is more a favorite hobby than a calling & has improved over the past year as she’s learned that dad isn’t as dumb as she thinks he is.) In fact, when it came to recent college apps, I passed some suggestions through my wife & daughter # 1 to avoid confrontation. Now, with that in mind…</p>
<p>I rarely let an opportunity go by to give/get a kiss or a hug, or make sure they know that I love them more than anything. Before the HS Senior leaves in the morning, I usually manage to bestow a peck on the head while she’s brushing her teeth. I have no doubt that this helps mitigate some of the more contentious situations that have arisen over the past few years.</p>
<p>Perhaps you can persuade your husband to both show his affection and perhaps even make the point to your daughter that he loves her very much and is simply afraid of the choices she’s making and their long term effect on her. You & she can point out that she’s keeping up her grades and is being responsible. And he needs to think about whether he still wants to be fortunate to even have a relationship with her 10 years from now. It’s not an instant fix. And I'm likely assuming too much. But it might be a start... and might help bring down associated stress levels. And if you can’t get him this far, counseling may be a pipe dream.</p>
<p>"Personally, I would hate counseling. Being a little obstinate, I don't like listening to the advise of others when they don't know what is going on and how I feel."</p>
<p>ruskie; I'm not sure what folks here mean by "counseling", but "therapy" is NOT about giving advice.</p>
<p>FannyPack-
Oldfort has nailed this on the head, In my humble opinion, as a mother of three college age kids. My oldest had a similar, combative relationship with my husband and they both came through these years with a renewed understanding. Sounds like your D is doing
ordinary 18 year old things - finding her way in the world. Also, don't put so much stock in this boyfriend who might be a thing of the past soon. DO get help through counselling
but don't make this about YOUR failures, etc. Good luck and take care.</p>
<p>Ex-husband must be wondering why suddenly I am making sure that dd is visiting daddy regularly and often.</p>
<p>Could it be that HS junior DD has turned in a raving ***** and there is a limit to how many weekends of raw hostility that this single mom wants to deal with. As an earlier post said "put on your own oxygen mask first"</p>
<p>Dad II...you have posted on a several threads about being drunk, and drinking a lot. I had to think long and hard about posting this...I hope you are not drinking to excess, and if you are, I hope you get yourself some help...SOON. In addition, this is a college forum where students as well as parents read. Posting about your excess drinking is not something that I feel is a "good example" for our students. First...my opinion...no one should be drinking in excess. AND second...posting it on the internet is not sensible.</p>
<p>And if a person has never tried counseling or therapy, they shouldn't look down their nose at it. It is extremely helpful to those who are open to it, and the cost/benefit of good therapy is far more longlasting than the money spent on a $126 lobster, a $300 meal with good wine, a several hundred dollar camera lens or even a Caribbean vacation.</p>
<p>***And I forgot to ask, what does the fact that they "are doing well financially because they can pay 1/2 the cost of the expenses of a private college" have do do with the issue of the struggle between father and daughter? Everything isnt about money or financial status, dadII.</p>
<p>"Dad II...you have posted on a several threads about being drunk, and drinking a lot. I had to think long and hard about posting this...I hope you are not drinking to excess, and if you are, I hope you get yourself some help...SOON. In addition, this is a college forum where students as well as parents read. Posting about your excess drinking is not something that I feel is a "good example" for our students. First...my opinion...no one should be drinking in excess. AND second...posting it on the internet is not sensible."</p>
<p>I agree with Thumper.</p>
<p>
[quote]
And if a person has never tried counseling or therapy, they shouldn't look down their nose at it. It is extremely helpful to those who are open to it, and the cost/benefit of good therapy is far more longlasting than the money spent on a $126 lobster, a $300 meal with good wine, a several hundred dollar camera lens or even a Caribbean vacation.
[/quote]
</p>
<p>It's all about priorities I suspect. I think it is hard for men in particular to embrace any kind of support. And therapy/counseling does provide, if nothing else, support. One of the things I have learned through past therapy is that men, in a very general way, have difficulty finding the language of feelings. There are typically two emotions: Anger and Happy. There is no fear, no sad, no anxious. It's very much black and white and so ... it would appear they go from zero to 60 when in reality some of what reeves up their emotions is not really understanding WHAT it is that their feeling. Men are much more pragmatic than women and women don't seem to get defensive of their emotions. Women have the benefit of language. For all that is said about women talking to much, men don't talk enough.</p>
<p>And as an aside: Drinking to excess is just one more way of numbing oneself to their feelings. It doesn't surprise me one bit that someone who drinks a lot rejects a discussion on emotionally driven issues.</p>